Eighth Edition for Life

Just a quick post today. Although i’ve been playing and enjoying a lot of Kings of War this year, I still have a massive hankering for 8th edition warhammer fantasy.

Many of the dedicated older forums (Herdstone, Asrai etc.) have seen massive reductions in footfall since AoS (although some of the admin said it occurred before then). Most is down to the fall of the old world but in some cases (such as with the oldhammer forum) it was likely due to the creation of a facebook group and most members just post there. Some of the forums have even been taken down for extended periods (which is one of the reasons I started the blog as I retain control over it and my posts will stay up as long as I want…)

A group of the players that still love and play whfb 8th edition have set up a new* forum. It is very active and everyone is really helpful and friendly, so if you still want to post about and discuss 8th ed, I really recommend giving in a visit (I can be found posting under the name Knoffles).

Eighth Edition for Life – http://eefl.freeforums.net/

* ok by new I mean in the last few years though i’ve only just found it.

Evaluation of the Herd of Khazbar the Reborn (KOW)

As normal, now the games are completed i’ll take a look at the list and try and give an evaluation of how I think each element performed and what (if anything) I would change for future games.

I’ll recap my list and then comment.


Herd of Khazbar the Reborn

Khazbar (Shaman) – Heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed (Shaman) – Heal – 120pts

Zhurrock the Mighty (Great Chieftain) – Chariot + Bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

(Brutox) – 220pts

(Brutox) – 220pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers (Horde) – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns (Regiment) – 145pts

Stampede (Horde) – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes (Horde) – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Beast Pack (Troop) – 70pts

Beast Pack (Troop) – 70pts


Shamans. Absolutely fantastic. Heal was a 100% required as an upgrade and I found myself using it more than bane chant. If anything, I need to take an additional shaman but mounted, so they can keep up with the herd when it marches and still heal.

Chieftain on Chariot. I found myself always using him in conjunction with one of the Brutox and they worked really well together. The bows and fire oil upgrades did almost nothing and I probably wouldn’t bother with them going forward. I do feel that to get the most out of him I probably need to give him wine of the elven kind so he has nimble (though this is pricey). The question is whether he is worth the points when another spirit walker horde is only a bit more.

Brutox. I love these models though I’m not convinced on their ability to cause damage (I don’t like the random element of the attacks but the CS 2 is nice). They work well on the flanks and are pretty survivable (if I remember the regenerate!). Being large gribblies, they also have the bonus of drawing an opponents attention to them. I would definitely take one (or two) again.

Tribal Spirit Walkers. One word: amazing. I love this horde. It does suffer from being fragile as anything so it needs supporting with a second horde! The crushing strength item was a good purchase but I only included it as I had points spare.

Longhorns. I struggled to use this unit effectively. I found it too fragile and the lack of attacks compared with other units was really noticeable.

Stampede. Another fantastic unit. The brew of sharpness item really assisted its damage output, though I would be tempted with adding the additional movement item for a cheaper version. This will definitely be a mainstay in future armies.

Guardian Brutes. Again I really like this unit. Defence 5 makes a real difference and giving them elite always helped in attack. I would use them again with no hesitation.

Beast Packs. Fantastic chaff. I do need to learn to use them effectively as I was hit and miss in their application. 2 troops are prerequisites in any list.

Going forward

I need more chaff pure and simple. This realistically means Harpies (gargoyles? I forget the name) as I only own 10 beasts and also have 10 harpies. I could include a troop of hunters (and will try them) but I prefer the increased movement of the flying birdwomen.

As stated above I want a mounted Shaman in the list as it will allow it to keep up with the fast movers.

I fell afoul of large flyers in a number of my games and had nothing comparable with that depth of movement. As such I will also be swopping one of the Brutox for a chimera in order to try it out at some point. This also makes me want to support it with the avatar of the father, as a flying wing (so may mean the other is removed).

Lycans seem to be one of the go to unit selections and I could try them using my Minotaur models but I prefer not to proxy where possible.

So what will I take in my next list? If I use Herd, it will probably be:

Spirit walker horde – 230pts

Spirit walker horde – 230pts

2 * beast packs – 70 * 2 = 140pts

Stampede (blessing of the gods) – 285pts

Guardian brutes – 230pts

2 * shamans (heal) – 120 * 2 = 240pts

Avatar (heal + wings) – 345pts

Chimera (wings) – 210pts

Harpies – 90pts.

Very few items in the list and has a similar number of drops as the comp list.

There is however a good chance I’ll try a different army. I have some elves I’ve been itching to use…

KOW – Herd of Khazbar vs Alex’s Elves – SELWG Competition game

My final game of the group stage was vs Alex Mountain and his Elves. I’ve faced Alex a couple of times before at Warhammer and he can be a canny opponent. He was particularly good at using Chaff in that system, so I was expecting this to carry over to this one.

Alex’s Elf list – 2000pts

Kindred Archer Horde – Brew of Keen Eyedness – 295pts

Kindred Archer Horde – Jar of Four Winds – 285pts. (They may look suspiciously like unpainted 5th edition Bretonnians in the pictures but Alex assured me that yes they were in fact elves, with extra large sunhats on. It was funny but in the course of the game he had to explain this to 4 or 5 others who for some inexplicable reason had come to the same conclusion as me).

Hunters of the Wild Troop – 135pts

Hunters of the Wild Troop – 135pts

Kindred Tallspears Troop – 100pts

Silverbreeze Cavalry Troop – Brew of haste – 160pts

Stormwind Cavalry Troop – Diadem of Dragon-kind – 170pts

Stormwind Cavalry Troop – Potion of the Caterpillar – 160pts

Bolt Thrower – 90pts

Dragon Kindred Lord – Ensorcelled Armour – 345pts (Again this in no way looked the slightest bit like a Zombie Dragon with an undead rider but instead completely resembled a haughty elf riding his noble dragon).

Mounted Mage – Inspiring Talisman – 125pts

As normal I’ll take a look at his units and then try and see if I can guess his deployment.

His entire army has elite, allowing him to re-roll 1’s on the hit roll. This is possibly one of my favourite army wide rules.

Horde of Archers – With 20 attacks, hitting on 4+ and a standard 24″ range, these will project a solid area of denial. One of the units will have a range of 36″ due to the Jar and the other will hit on 3+.  I won’t lie, these do worry me somewhat as if they focus on the same target, they will be deleting units pretty quickly,

Bolt Thrower – I’ve found bolt throwers hit and miss with just 2 attacks. They do have a 48″ range so will be threatening my forces from the first turn. Their piercing is somewhat wasted on my army so overall i’m not too fussed about this unit.

Silverbreeze Cavalry – This is the last of his ranged units and what he would have used as chaff in the previous system. With the brew of haste it would have a range of 11″, the most of any unit on the field. They also have nimble and bows so they could easily delete my chaff from the get go and start chipping away at other units/get in the way. They are a prime target for my limited ranged units.

Hunters of the Wild – This unit pumps out a lot of attacks for their size and with Vanguard, they could potentially be in my face really early on and he has 2 of them. They do need to attack first as with their low nerve (10/12), they’ll die to a stiff breeze. They are also a prime target for my Chieftains ranged attack as even a few wounds could remove them.

Kindred Tallspears – This unit is probably the closet to chaff in his list in terms of points. I suspect their sole use is to get in the way of anyone going for his hordes.

Stormwind Cavalry – The troops only have 8 attacks but hit on a 3+ with TC (2) and have a def of 5+. Again the nerve is low at 11/13. He will definitely be wanting to get these guys in the flank to maximise their potential. One of them also has a breath attack (10) which can so some damage.

Mounted Mage – This guy is fairly bare bones with heal (3) and Bane Chant (2). I think his primary job is to buff the 2 hordes.

Dragon Kindred Lord – another filthy flyer 😉 with ensorcelled armour. I just need to try and ensure he doesn’t get behind my lines.

This is the most amount of shooting i’ve come up against so far, so it will be a good experience for me. I would expect the Archer hordes to make up the centre of the lines with maybe the bolt thrower in between them. The mage will likely be nearby to throw on a bane chant.

Everything in his army, with the exception of the 2 hordes and the Dragon Lord, have a top nerve of 13 or less so should be easy to remove.

He also has the same number of drops as my list (11).

To recap my list.

The Herd of Khazbar the Reborn – 2000pts

Khazbar – Shaman – heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed – Shaman – heal – 120pts

Zurrock the Mighty – Chieftain on Chariot – bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers – Horde – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Stampede – Horde – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes – Horde – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Brutox – 220pts

Brutox – 220pts


We rolled map pack 5, from  Neil’s terrain generator, which gave us 4 buildings, a wood, a hill and 24 inches of obstacles. After deployment it looked like this:

1 Terrain

1 Terrain

Scenario and Deployment

The game was Dominate which was nice, as I hadn’t played this yet and due to the fortuitous placement of the woods, might give me an edge with my army wide pathfinder.

Alex won the roll for sides and the armies after deployment looked like this. (his right most hunters vanguarded up to the wall and those on the other side of his lines moved up to the building.

2 Deployment

2 Deployment Herd3 Deployment Elves4 Deployment Elves5 Deployment all

He then won the roll for first turn which he took.

Turn 1 – Elves

The Elven right flank surged forward with the hunters, Stormwind Cavalry and his Dragon Lord making the most of the lack of Herd on that side of the board. There was little movement on the other side of the board with the exception of the Silverbreeze that moved to cover the nearby heavy cavalry.

His massed shooting opened up, the herd lines withered under the deluge of arrows with one of the beast packs left as a pincushion.

3 Turn 1 Elves

7 Turn 1 Elves

8 Turn 1 Elves9 Turn 1 Elves

Turn 1 – Herd

Zurrock seeing an early chance in the game, unleashed the Brutox and he charged in alongside to wipe out the Silverbreeze Cavalry. Unable to contain its bloodlust, the Brutox overran towards the Stormwind who had been cowering behind.

In the centre the Stampede forced the longhorns forward to act a emergency chaff. The brutes also moved up to take advantage of the cover.

The Spirit Walkers, their numbers replenished by the duel heal thrown on them, swung round to join the Brutox in forming a new battle line to tackle the Elven flanking force (conveniently making sure the dragon couldn’t get behind the lines).

4 turn 1 herd

10 Turn 1 Herd13 Turn 1 Herd12 Turn 1 Herd11 Turn 1 Herd

Turn 2 – Elves

The rain of Arrows continued with the remaining beast pack doing its job and ensuring more valuable targets were spared. The Longhorns were subject to the brunt of the shooting and failed to survive the fire. The Herd ranks were starting to thin rapidly.

Faced with a slavering monster, unable to escape its charge arc and with no ranged support to help them, the heavy cavalry realised they were going to have to do more than just posture. They swallowed deeply, charged in and managed to waver it. It was hard to tell if the horses or elves were the more terrified of what was sure to occur next, with all eyes rolling and the whites showing.

The flanking force moved up to form a coherent line with the lord on dragon showing what dastardly underhanded tactics the elves would stoop to by flying forward and fitting into the smallest possible gap between the table edge and the flank of the Brutox.

5 turn 2 elves

14 Turn 2 Elves
Remember, NOT a Zombie Dragon!

15 Turn 2 Elves

16 Turn 2 Elves
The bottom horde of archers thought that no-one would notice that were Bretonnians if they stayed as far away from the action as possible.

17 Turn 2 Elves

Turn 2 – Herd

The Brutox, ignoring it’s waver, and Chieftain charged into the Stormwind Cavalry and barely raised a claw in anger before the Elves ran off the table. The Blood drunk monster regenerating as it savored it’s first taste of elf.

Knowing that their lines were in trouble due to the position of the Dragon, the left flank pushed up aggressively with the Brutox covering the rear of the Spirit Walkers (this was one situation where the oversized base actually worked in my favour!).

In the centre, the Guardian Brutes moved into the forest followed closely by Khazbar. Wazzock stayed with the Stampede, remaining out of the range of the nearest horde.

6 turn 2 herd

18 Turn 3 Herd19 Turn 3 Herd20 Turn 3 Herd21 Turn 3 Herd

Turn 3 – Elves

The hunters that were still hiding in the eves of the large tower, spun round as the recognised the threat that was rapidly approaching from the other side of the buikdings. The Elven Phalanx moved over to block any potential charge from the Stampede, now that the hunters had been re-tasked. This move also opened up the firing lanes for the two hordes to target the Guardian Brutes but the cover impeded their aim and the damage for fairly insignificant. The Bolt thrower had but one option and shot into the writhing mass of animals making up the stampede.

On the other flank, the Hunters and Stormwind combined to charge the Spirit Walkers felling half their number. Despite, in a move reeking of fear, charging the Brutox in the flank, the Dragon rider failed to remove it.

7 turn 3 elves

Turn 3 – Herd

Zurrock and accompanying Brutox (who continued to regen), finished their flanking maneuver and moved up to now threaten the Elven shooters.

The Spirit Walkers, blood raised, counter charged the hunters and made short work of them. The Brutox also counter-charged but into the Dragon causing a few wounds but more importantly disordering it (I cunningly also forgot to roll to regen the 10 wounds on it – probably as we forgot to mark the wounds up!).

In the centre, Khazbar invoked the power of his amulet, first healing and then bane-chanting the Brutes. They then stormed into the flank of the Spear elves and that fight was only ever going to go one way. The Stampede and Wazzock then moved up in support. The Herd were now threatening the elven shooters that had caused so much damage early on.

8 turn 3 herd

Turn 4 – Elves

The remaining Hunter troop moved to block the herd charging the flank of the shooters.

The Stormwind and Dragon Lord both charged into their respective targets (Spirit Walkers and Brutox) and both units were removed as a consequence (Alex, ever the gent, did say I could roll the regen when we realised there were no wound counters on the model and it hadn’t been done but I refused as it was a comp game and frankly that will teach me for not remembering my own armies rules!)

9 turn 4 elves                                      .

22 Turn 4 Elves23 Turn 4 Elves

Turn 4 – Herd

Eager to clear a path to the hordes of archers that had killed so many of their herd, the chieftain and Brutox tore through the hunters that stood in their path.

Wazzock cast a heal on the Stampede before sending it forward where it crashed into the nearest archers. Elven bodies were pulped under the crushing bodies and despite cowering in the mud, their mettle held under the gaze of the nearby mage and they held their ground.

10 turn 4 herd

Turn 5 – Elves

Realising that they needed to support their brethren in the centre, the Bretonnians Elven archers marched forward with all haste. The mage also moved up.

The Dragon Lord and Stormwind cavalry both moved up to the woods and rather than engage in honorable combat they both used their breath weapons to torch the woods. As Khazbar looked to be burnt to a crisp, their was a flash of green and he disappeared.

11 turn 5 elves

24 Turn 5 Elves

Turn 5 – Herd

The Stampede again charged the archers and this time their nerve broke and they fled from the field. The Brutox then proceeded to trample the bolt thrower and crew into the ground.

Zurrock moved towards the centre ready to contest it.

12 turn 5 herd

Turn 6 – Elves

The remaining archer horde turned and tried to remove the Stampede but the legendary elven archery skill deserted them facing a sea of ferocious animals.

The Dragon Lord, mage and Stormwind Cavalry all moved in to contest the centre of the battlefield.

13 turn 6 elves

Turn 6 – Herd

In the final turn of the game, the remaining herd units rushed towards the centre of the board. Zurrock charged the Dragon Lord, inflicting minor injuries and Wazzock moved up to support.

14 turn 6 elves

25 End of Game


Alex won having the requisite 200pt advantage in the centre circle (640pts vs 325pts). The Stampede was not able to get entirely into the centre circle so did not count towards the total.
In terms of kill points, Alex and his sleazy, untrustworthy elves, back stabbed 1150pts of the noble Herd, whilst the Khazbar eradicated 1075pts of the elven vermin.
(Herd Remaining: Shaman – 120 + Stampede – 305 + Chieftain – 205 + Brutox 220 = 850)
(Elves Remaining: Archer Horde (jar) – 285 + Stormwind Cav (Diadem) – 170 + Dragon Lord – 345 + Mage – 125 = 925).


I always really enjoy my games against Alex, they are normally close run affairs and this was no exception. During the game there was tension, beaded sweat on brows, swearing (that was me), disgraceful dancing with glee (that was me again), instant karma (due to the aforementioned dancing) and a good amount of laughs.

I made some errors straight off the bat on this. I should have deployed one set of buildings more in the centre of the board as this would have obstructed the lanes of fire. I guess i’d been caught out before with obstacles and the impact of crossing them whilst facing archers, so didn’t want them to impede my movement. I was reasonably happy with my deployment though.

Probably my greatest mistake was moving up in the centre way too early. If i’d either set up further back or retreated in the opening move, it would have limited the early shooting and thus the units killed off and might have meant i’d been able to concentrate on the flanking elven force. But more to the point I should have waited until my own flanking force had moved up and was threatening the flank of the archers before moving my forces forward.

Forgetting to role regen on the Brutox when it had suffered 10 wounds was poor and that could have been the difference between that unit dying or lasting another turn.

It is worth mentioning that Alex managed to bane chant one of his archer hordes every single turn on two dice. A feat i’ve not seen or even managed with my 3 dice BC.

As things go that loss is likely to mean a bottom two finish in the group (i’ll probably be fighting the bottom spot with Tony). Neil will probably top it and Dan has a good chance of second though that will likely depend on his match with Alex.

Kill points will decide which 2 runner ups will progress through after the 2 top spots in each group but after my poor first game vs Neil, where I failed to route anything, I seriously doubt i’m in with a chance of scrapping through.


Hobby update – Beastpacks/Chaos Hounds and next up.

It’s been bugging me that I had one element of my Kings of War competition army that wasn’t painted and so I finally knuckled down and ‘finished’ off the 2 troops of Beastpacks. 

Lacking inspiration and to ensure continuity with the rest of the army, I followed the same procedure as the wolves in the Stampede. This meant they looked pretty bland (grey with a blue wash and dry brushed) so I added a few extra bits of detail ensuring the scales/spines were green with a bit of highlighting to signify they might be poisoned. 

I still need to base them but at least I now have a fully painted comp’ army.

Next on the painting table list is to revisit the ghorgon/Brutox models and add more detail to break up the brown and then I may even (shock horror) open up the space marine box, as I’ve been reading a number of the ’40k battles’ series recently and this together with the new rule set, actually has me interested (ok quite excited) about trying it out again! I’ve briefly covered/shown part of my paint scheme in a previous post (dark green with tiger stripes on an orange background as the chapter logo). They will of course be a chapter of my own devising but are currently leaning towards being scions of the blood angels, mainly as loving the fluff around their curse and having just finished off the novel Flesh Tearers it reinforced this. (This might possibly change as previously I leant towards imperial fists but found them a bit boring. But that’s the joy of creating your own chapter, you can play a few games and try out the army styles first, especially as it will just be some friendly games at the club).

With the break from the traditional shades of red on the marines, I might the have to paint the Death Company (once bought) red with black crosses as at least then they will tie back to the parent chapter but as a mirror image as in this chapter those with the curse are more revered for having embraced their fathers final wish for vengeance and blood. Those who hold off from the curse see themselves as having the unenviable duty of overseeing the chapter to ensure its continuality for the next generation. A necessity before they can allow themselves to embrace their fathers legacy. Needless to say, with their larger than average Death Company, the chapter operates on the fringes of the imperium and will normally only commit to solitary actions against targets where total annihilation is required. Their home world’s location currently remains a mystery but it is rumoured to be deep within Xenos territory, on a planet previously colonised but long forgotten by imperium records.

KoW – SELWG comp update

I’m not planning on doing many updates for this (bar my normal battle reps) but enough has happened in the leagues that I thought i’d post an update. regular updates are posted on the club forums.

As it stands, the leagues look like this:

League update 9-5-17


As normal Dan Neil and myself have stormed ahead on the number of games played and I’m currently languishing in third in the self styled ‘group of death’. My battle reports can be found here:

Vs Neil’s Abyssals

Vs Dan’s Dwarves

Vs Tony’s Herd

As for the rest of the games, the following passage is a bit of a write up of the top of the table clash between Neil and Dan (written by Neil).

Going the full 7 turns in the Kill scenario i was the lucky victor, by the smallest of margins (200pts).
As you could imagine a cagey affair with either player looking for the smallest advantage.

With his Gem of Zellak Dan enjoyed the advantage in deployment by putting his main force on side of the board.
However he left his Rangers isolated on the other side, hoping to shoot off some way wood Hellhounds. Not quite routing
the Hellhounds, the Rangers paid the price later.

With the limited manoeuvrability the Dwarfs held their lines with the Brock Riders trying to get round my flank.
The Arch Fiend was able to remove both Flame Belchers before they could cause much damage.

There then followed a serious of combats which saw both sides take casualties. Dan had a nasty surprise when a unit of Succubi
got into the flank of a horde of Shieldbreakers with 50 attacks.

The last turns came down to my horde of lower Abyssal’s v the two Greater Earth Elementals. The Lower A’s were able to rout
one GEE & then reform to avoid the deadly flank charge from the other.(1250 v 1450)

The other game also featured Dan & the President.
Not many details here, but Dan won 2000 v 825.


The first (and so far only) game in Basilea league was played between Darren & Martin, with Darren the Victor. Here is a brief account from Darren.

It was tough going though, in one melee I threw 92 dice by attacking a unit in both its flank and to its front, and still only inflicted 8 wounds. With such dicing even Martin couldn’t stop himself laughing.

But I still won the game, so I think I should be awarded an additional point for overcoming such a ruthless & unscrupulous opponent………I’m referring to bad luck……. not Martin.

As far as units lost and points please see below.

I lost:

1 Zombie Legion @ 190
1 Zombie legion @ 190
1 Revenant cavalry @ 200

Total lost= 580

Martin lost:

1 Bombard @ 110
1 Shieldbreaker @ 250
1 Shieldbreaker @ 250
1 Crossbows @ 260

Total lost = 760


So the Ophidia league has been rather busy lately with 3 games to report.

Neil & George faced off in Kill & pillage with a resulting draw, advantage to Neil with 1285 v 1130. I believe a report is to follow.

Neil V Alistair resulted in a win for Alistair 1405 to 595, not sure of the scenario.

Please see below for a report from George’s battle with Alistair (from George’s perspective). Win for George 1360 v 435.

So we have a real rock, paper, scissors developing in this league with draws making the league very tight.

George vs Alistair – Scenario: Kill

Alistair killed: 435pts

George killed: 1360pts

Our battlefield layout played into my hands a bit as we had three buildings spread out diagonally with woods between the gaps in the centre, which effectively divided the battlefield in two and forced us both to split our forces accordingly.  I deployed my chariots, gladestalkers, seaguard and mage on my right with a hill directly in front of them – opposite were Alistair’s werewolves and troll hordes, screened by ghoul chaff.  In the centre i arranged my two palace guard regiments and banner bearer so they were screened on their left by trees and buildings and next to them filling my line between the sea guard and the palace guard were my heavy cavalry – opposite them was Alistair’s spearmen, deployed between a building and a set of woods, and his Wraiths.  On my left i deployed my light cavalry and flying hero on the far side of another building, and my woodsmen in the wood between the two buildings – while Alistair deployed his heavy cavalry and archers horde opposite them as this was otherwise a very open flank and perfect for cavalry.

Alistair gave me the first turn, which saw me promptly turn my light cavalry 90 degrees and hightail it to the other end of the board where the rest of my army was arrayed.  I moved my seaguard, scouts and mage onto the hill where they were able (with some very good dice rolling) to pepper & weaken (the trolls) and eventually break (in subsequent turns) Alistair’s Werewolves. The ghoul screens were destroyed in combat but they did break my gladestalkers and threatened to do the same to my seaguard.  Alistair kept pressure up by sending in the wraiths, but by the time they got through my light cavalry and hero arrived on the flank and started shooting.  Eventually i charged these guys on three sides – and got only one wound – only a very lucky (jammy) double 6 broke them.  Alistair got a charge on the flank of one of my chariots with his trolls but they were then out of position which allowed my cavalry time to manoeuvre, charge and destroy the trolls who had been weakened by some very lucky shooting.

in the centre i was able to charge down the undead spearmen with a palace guard regiment and position my other regiment so the open gap between the woods on Alistair’s side and the building in the middle of the table was covered on two sides by my palace guard.

on my left, Alistair quickly moved to redeploy his archers and cavalry against my army, but the undead units weren’t quick enough and by the time they arrived i had my palace guard arranged to face them.  the revenant cavalry got charged by both units and despite hindered chargers, were routed.  Alistair’s horde of arches tried to shoot one unit down but were unsuccessful (sight of relief there) and were then charged and broken in turn.  The soul reavers made a play through the woods on my side of the table but were opposite a regiment of woodland troops who did nothing to them (those cavalry have 20 attacks, thunderous charge 2, crushing strength 2, 3+ to hit and 6+ to save????) but they did hold up the cavalry long enough to effectively neutralize them for the rest of the game.  They did get on to my right flank but by the time they go there (turn 7) the rest of my army had turned to face them.

in summary, my maneuvering at the beginning at the game helped immensely to neutralize Alistair’s deadly cavalry but it was a lot of fortunate dice rolling that helped everywhere else.  I got routed results often just as i needed them, often by only a single point and sometimes only by rolling a jammy double 6.  My shooting was also quite a bit more effective than the dice should have allowed for as well so Alistair was quite unlucky there but it was a very fun game and as i have found with KOW it really was down to the wire as the soul reavers were unlucky not to break my woodsmen sooner, and had the werewolves lasted another turn they would have been breaking my chariots and probably turned my flank there.

KOW – Herd of Khazbar vs Tony’s Herd – SELWG Competition game

The third of my competition games is perhaps the one I was most looking forward to. This is because it is against the only member of the group that i’ve never played before. It also happens that Tony is the club President so i had to ensure my best behaviour 😉. Tony was also the only other player in the comp’ using the Herd but with different take with his list. I was pleased about that as it gave me a chance to see things in action that I wouldn’t normally take myself.

As normal I’ll start by caveating that any errors in this post are down to my notes and/or memory.

Tony’s Herd List – 2000pts

Great Chieftain – 140pts

Shaman – Heal – 120pts

Shaman – Heal – 120pts

Tribal Warriors – horde – 200pts

Tribal Warriors – horde – 200pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Longhorns – Regiment – Blessing of the gods – 170pts

Tribal Spears – Horde – 205pts

Hunters – Troop – 75pts

Harpies – Troop – 90pts

Guardian Brutes – Regiment – 150pts

Tribal Chariots – Regiment – Potion of the Caterpillar – 160pts

Brutox – 220pts

I’m going to start by looking at the elements that i’ve not seen before.

Tribal Warriors Horde – These look to be a fairly standard horde stats with, high nerve (20/22), melee and def of 4+ and 25 attacks. It also has the army wide TC (1) and pathfinder. This makes it no slouch in combat but nothing out of the ordinary. However he does have two of them!

Tribal Spears Horde – Again the stats are similar with melee/def of 4+. It differs as it has a slightly lower nerve (19/21) more attacks (30) and the Phalanx rule, which negates TC if charged from the front (which will impact most of my units). This makes this unit far more dangerous than the warriors in my eyes (at least to attack) and it’s only 5 more points.

Hunters Troop – This is one of his two chaff units. Hitting on 5’s, doesn’t cause much worry and with a 3+ def and 8/10 nerve they will die to a swift breeze. They do however have vanguard and throwing weapons, so will use this potentially contest objectives and to start chipping away at my units from the word go. They would be dangerous if they hit my own chaff for even a single wound.

Tribal Chariots Regiment – This is the final unit that i’ve not seen/used.  It hits hard on a 3+ with TC (2) and has caterpillar to ensure it retains the TC. It does only have 8 attacks so, like the longhorns, ideally wants to get in a flank. It does have Sp 8 so is his joint 2nd fastest unit (matching the Brutox). Bows does give it a ranged threat but it hits on 5+ so this reduces to a 6 when they move. It also only has a 11/13 nerve and 4+ def so shouldn’t survive much attention.

Great Chieftain – I really want to see how Tony uses this character as I’ve only used the chariot version. He also has a good def (5) and hits reasonably hard (3+ with both CS and TC 1) but only ever with 5 attacks due to being an individual.

Guardian Brutes Regiment – Again this is a unit I use but i’ve never run anything less than a horde so I was curious how differently the regiment would perform. It has half the attacks (12) and a lower nerve (12/15 vs 15/18), which puts it in a similar range as the Longhorns but harder hitting. It retains the def 5 so can absorb hits from the right enemy.

Shaman – Like myself he is running 2 shamans upgraded with heal (5). With inspire and BC (3) as standard they are extremely versatile and I can’t overstate how much I really love these in the support role.

Longhorn Regiments – these elite beastmen hit consistently hard and I’ve found using two regiments as a team work really well, as in this role they act as another horde when attacking.

Harpies – the second of his chaff and I think his most versatile with fly, nimble and vicious (I’m still regretting not taking a unit). If this gets into my backfield it could cause some real issues. In some ways I would prefer it to block me so I could remove it early on.

Brutox – I’ve not made up my mind about the Brutox. I want to love it and my last game showed me its potential but it’s yet to reach it. I have a sneaky suspicion we might be having a ‘Brutox off’ on a flank so I’ll try and swing that in my favour with support.

As normal I wrote this but before the battle and tried to think how I would deploy his army. I’d expect the 2 units of Warriors to form the core of his line and the final horde of Tribal spears to anchor one end. I’d want the longhorns to back these units up and hit flanks where possible to maximise their smaller number of attacks. The Brutox and Chariots i’d put on one flank to cause mischief. Harpies and Hunters would be there to get in the way. I’m not sure where he’d put the Brutes. If I had flyers, then i’m sure either they or one of the Longhorns would be held in reserve. They might anchor the other end of the horde line, with a Longhorn regiment behind them, as their high def should help mitigate any initial damage.

Looking at his list, a number of things immediately jumped out at me. He had almost no magic items and he had a bucket load of infantry units. The three hordes, in themselves would give him a large frontage and combined with the 2 longhorn regiments, would likely cover over half the table making it hard to flank him.

I have to try and flank him though, as even my strongest units will not chew through a horde in a single turn and I have found that  my hordes will generally only survive for 1 or possibly 2 rounds of combat against another horde (the spirit horde really suffers with its low def). Unfortunately he has 2 more drops than I do meaning that it will be that much harder to accomplish.

Quite a few of his units (bar the hordes), do have low nerve, so I might be able to remove them quite quickly.

I also won’t be able to use terrain to my advantage as he has all the same inherent army rules, so I’m going to have to play this one carefully.

My final note to myself is to remember that guardian brutes don’t have pathfinder. I must remember to use them in open ground!!


The Herd of Khazbar the Reborn – 2000pts

Khazbar – Shaman – heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed – Shaman – heal – 120pts

Zurrock the Mighty – Chieftain on Chariot – bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers – Horde – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Stampede – Horde – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes – Horde – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Brutox – 220pts

Brutox – 220pts


We rolled Map pack 6 from Neil’s terrain generator, which contained: 4*tree bases, 2 hills, 2*marsh. I rolled player A and the terrain was set up as follows.

  1. Player A places 4*trees, anywhere on the table except in DZ’s and no nearer than 6” from any table edge & at least 6” apart.
  2. Player B places 2*marsh in any DZ at least 9” from any table edge. Both can be in the same DZ.
  3. Player A places 1 hill anywhere on the table 9” from any table edge.
  4. Player A places 1 hill anywhere on the table 9” from any table edge.

1 Terrain


The terrain was so evenly placed that we kept sides but Tony won the roll so started to deploy first. I kept to my pre-game deployment strategy (which was slightly different to the last game).

I won the first turn roll and elected to go first.

2 Deployment

1 Deployment - Herd of Khazbar2 Deployment - herd of Khazbar3 Deployment - herd of Khazbar4 Deployment - Tony's Herd5 Deployment - Tony's Herd6 Deployment - Overall

Turn 1 – Herd of Khazbar

With a loud bray, Khazbar signaled his forces to move forward. The centre advanced carefully with right flank being more aggressive. The Brutox on the left flank advanced using wood to shield it, backed up by the chief, who shot a few wounds on the nearest warrior horde.

3 Turn 1 - Mark Herd

7 - Turn 1 - Herd of Khazbar8 - Turn 1 - Herd of Khazbar9 - Turn 1 - Herd of Khazbar

Turn 1 – Tony’s Herd

The enemy forces mirrored Khazbar’s approach and also advanced cautiously in the centre. The Brutox cleared the wood and positioned to force an action from Zurrock and his supporting Brutox next turn. The Harpies flew up the other side of the wood to also threaten their flank.

On the other side of the battlefield, the hunters launched their axes at the the stampede causing some flesh wounds.

The Chariots then charged the beast pack, their scythes cutting the dogs to pieces and the steel rims of the wheels grinding the corpses into the mud.

4 Turn 1 - Tony Herd

10 - Turn 1 - Tony's Herd11 - Turn 1 - Tony's Herd

Turn 2 – Herd of Khazbar

In a preemptive strike on the left flank, the Brutox and Chieftain struck at the enemy Brutox softening it up.

The beast pack moved up to block the left most warrior horde, preventing it from supporting the Brutox or charging the Longhorns who had moved up to both avoid the Harpies and threaten the flank of the Brutox.

On the other flank the Stampede and Brutox obliterated the Chariots that faced them. The Brutox was unable to contain its fury and swept towards the Longhorn regiment that had moved up to support them.

5 Turn 2 - Mark Herd

12 - Turn 2 - Herd of Khazbar13 - Turn 2 - Herd of Khazbar14 - Turn 2 - Herd of Khazbar

Turn 2 – Tony’s Herd

The Brutox counter charged into the Chieftain but bounced after causing minimal wounds despite the bane chant that had swelled it’s muscles beyond their normal size. The Harpies continued to move round the wood so that they were now threatening the rear of Khazbar’s lines.

The Tribal Warriors steamrollered the blocking Beast Pack in short order, ready to assist the nearby Brutox.

The Elite Longhorns charged the Brutox on the far flank hoping to remove it. In that, they failed, but in a shocking turn of events the nearby troop of hunters charged the flank of the Stampede and wavered them showing up the cream of the Herd army. The Elites scowled at the hunters. The little runts would have to be slapped back into line later in case they forgot their place!

6 Turn 2 - Tony Herd

15 - Turn 2 - Tony's Herd16 - Turn 2 - Tony's Herd17 - Turn 2 - Tony's Herd

Turn 3 – Herd of Khazbar

Zurrock ordered his mount to re-engage the enemy Brutox. Assisted by a fresh charge from the raging giant next to him, they finally bought low the enemy Brutox. Zurrock then pulled sharply on his reins wheeling round to face the imminent attack of the Harpies.

Khazbar’s Longhorns and the horde of ravening Spirit Walkers both charged into the nearest Warrior horde and taking an affront to their unpainted nature, tore straight through them. The remnants quickly ran off the field of battle.

The Brutox on the far flank continued the war of attrition with the elite Longhorns.

7 Turn 3 - Mark Herd

Turn 3 – Tony’s Herd

The enemy hordes chose this moment to attack. The second warrior horde, seeking revenge hit the Spirit Walkers. Only the fearless nature of their foes prevented their destruction. The Spear Warriors also charged but targeted the Guardian Brute horde. Their lack of Crushing Strength or Thunderous charge prevented many wounds getting through the Guardian’s armour.

The Chief and the Harpies combined to try and remove Zurrock and despite causing damage, only wavered him. They were supported by the Longhorns who put a number of wounds on the Brutox.

The other unit of Elite Longhorns had more luck than their compatriots and bought low the other Brutox. The hunters, remembering they were not meant to do anything useful, missed the writhing mass of creatures two foot in front of them with all the weapons thrown in that direction!

8 Turn 3 - Tony Herd

18- Turn 3 - Tony's Herd19 - Turn 3 - Tony's Herd20 - Turn 3 - Tony's Herd

Turn 4 – Herd of Khazbar

Along the line, the Herd counter-charged where possible. The Brutox continued the fight with the enemy longhorns, regenerating wounds in the process. Khazbar’s elite warriors charged the Chieftain in an attempt to remove him and overrun to support the Brutox. Despite causing significant damage he gained inspiration from the nearby troops and held his ground.

Khazbar looked at Wazzock and they combined their healing to remove almost all the damage previously caused to the Spirit Horde. The revitalised horde then tore apart the enemy warriors infront of them. Khazbar then invoked the power of his amulet and cast bane chant on the Guardian Brutes to assist their ongoing combat with the Phalanx of spears.

Feeling outnumbered and taking advantage of the Hunters inability to have caused any nerve checks in the previous turn, they smashed apart the elite Longhorns and turned to face the remaining enemy on that side of the table looking to get some payback for the earlier cowardly flank charge. At this point the Hunters started to look rather worried.

9 Turn 4 - Mark Herd

21 - Turn 4 - Herd of Khazbar22 - Turn 4 - Herd of Khazbar23 - Turn 4 - Herd of Khazbar

Turn 4 – Tony’s Herd

With their numbers thinning, Tony’s forces tried to even the odds. The Chief and Harpies again tried to take down Zurrock and even with the Chief fluffing his atttacks, they again wavered him. Likewise, the Brutox was on the receiving end of the Longhorns attack but shrugged off the attacks.

The Regiment of Minotaurs that had been lurking in the back field, finally had a clear path and snorting and bellowing they crashed into the spirit walkers but were unable to break them due to the earlier healing.

The spears continued to target the Guardian Brute horde and were able to waver them in the process.

The two shamans each threw heals out. One to the Longhorns and the other to the Spears.

10 Turn 4 - Tony Herd

24 - Turn 4 - Tony's Herd25 - Turn 4 - Tony's Herd26 - Turn 4 - Tony's Herd

Turn 5 – Herd of Khazbar

In the decisive turn of the game, Khazbar’s forces stuck a number of fatal blows.

The Stampede secured the right flank (we just rolled the nerve test for the hunters due to their low nerve and number of attacks coming their way).

The Spirit Walker Horde and Guardian Brutes (Stone beating scissors Fury countering Waver) did enough damage to remove both their respective foes (Minotaurs and Spear Warriors).

The Longhorns took down the Chief and overran into Tony’s remaining Longhorn regiment and this combined with the counter charge from the Brutox (who continued to regenerate) sealed their fate. The Brutox seeking fresh meat then turned to face the harpies.

Both Khazbar and Wazzock  cast heal but this time they split the spells between the Spirit Walkers and the Guardian Brutes.

11 Turn 5 - Mark Herd

Turn 5 – Tony’s Herd

With a steely determination (or like a dog refusing to let go of a bone), the Harpies again charged the Zurrock and finally bought down the resilient Chieftain.

12 Turn 5 - Tony Herd

Turn 6 – Herd of Khazbar

We didn’t actually play this turn but it was pretty obvious that the raging Brutox would catch the harpies, whilst Tony’s Shaman’s would scuttle away to safety, keeping out of charge arcs and with that we called the game.


The final result was:

Mark – Killed: 1,760pts

Tony – Killed: 465pts

A first win for the Herd of Khazbar the Reborn and a whole 2 points!!


It was a thoroughly enjoyable game as it was very social and I got to know Tony a bit more. His army was mainly composed of classic GW metal Beastmen miniatures and those that were painted looked fantastic.

It turned out that Tony had played around the same number of KOW games as I had (not many) but over a much greater period, with his first game being just after KOW 2nd Ed had been released. Like me, he had entered the comp to get some games and further experience under his belt.

As with my last fight I had sketched out a pre-battle deployment. It had some fluidity as I wanted to ensure the Guardian Brutes were not impeded by terrain and I wanted to use the Brutox and Chieftain to get Tony to deploy items on the opposite flank to give the Stampede a chance to clear up the opposite one. In the main I was happy with how deployment worked out. His deployment was not too far off what I expected. I did underestimate what a wide frontage his force would have.

Leaving the flank of the stampede exposed to the hunters was an error. I underestimated that they could do that much damage even from the flank and the waver, although unexpected, could have as easily it could have been a route. I have a real blind spot with this unit and keep making the same mistake each game. It also shows that if I split my forces I really need a source of healing for each element (in this case, preferably a mounted shammy to keep up and also inspire!).

In hindsight (which is always a marvelous thing) I think Tony made a couple of errors in the game. Taking the bait and charging the beast pack with his Warriors took them out of the battle line and allowed me to duel charge them and destroy the unit in one round of combat. This lost him his superior numbers in the centre. Admittedly he was unlucky not to take my Spirit Walkers out in his turn and my double heal on the unit was definitely above average and kept them in the fight. In fact most of my heal rolls were very high which helped my hordes outlast Tony’s.

Holding back with the chariots and shooting the other beast pack may also have been the better option too as it would have allowed his longhorns to move up in support. In fairness he did forget they had bows at the time.

I also think he may have been better off moving the other longhorn unit so it was slightly in the woods. This would have given him the ability to flank the Brutox in combat with his Brutox. Even ending the Harpies first move in the woods, rather than behind them, would have influenced how I played both that flank and the centre. As it was I was able to use the woods to shield my movements.

Overall, although the margin of victory was quite high, I would say that this was more down to Tony’s lack of recent practice, rather than any superior generalship on my behalf. Good dice rolls and not making any real serious blunders also helped swing the battle my way.

My final group game vs Alex’s elves is scheduled in for 19th May.

New improved 40k, now with sprinkles!

Warning – a wall of text is incoming!

You either had to have been cut off from social media or have blocked out any GW related items to have missed the news that a new edition of 40k is on the horizon.

With the recent advancement of the plot line in the gathering storm books, I think we all surmised that it was in the wind and the only question was in what form it would take.

Tangent time: I make no bones of the fact that I went off GW for a while after the destruction of the old world. I had no issue with the advancement of the story per say but my beef foremost was with the fact they made AOS a skirmish game. I also loved the old world setting and all the fluff. I have most, if not all the novels and reread them often, meaning I had a lot of emotional investment in the setting. I also had issues with the company line at the time stating they were a ‘just’ a Miniatures company (I forget the exact comment). The number of rule books and codexes produced seemed to contradict this.

The new CEO has done a lot to improve the position of the company in the customers eyes. The new community team is doing its job well and GW appears to be listening and more importantly acting on feedback (whilst still looking after the profit line of course – they are after all a plc with shareholders to answer to). Even before the launch of the new edition they have an FAQ out and whilst it doesn’t answer all questions and skirts around a few key issues, is something the company wouldn’t have even bothered with a few years ago.

Tangent aside, in the last two years I’ve tried to get into 40k but struggled to do so. This was in part down to a number of reasons but in the main it was:

Rules – they are vast requiring many different books to get access to them all. This isn’t necessarily a bad thing as I liked this ‘depth’ with whfb, although 40k appears to suffer from a greater bloat than fantasy due to there being multiple codexes for some factions (looking at you space marines). I also struggled somewhat as many of the rule names (model abilities in particular) were the same between 40k and whfb but the mechanics operated differently. This made it difficult to easily transition from one system to another. 

This, combined with me giving Kings of War a go (with its streamlined rules), made me appreciate one of the reasons why the AOS rules are so much simpler. It allows more accessibility to new players. I can honestly say if the KOW ruleset had been the same as whfb I wouldn’t be playing it now. Simplifying the 40k ruleset will very likely make me play it.

I do think the change will be far less drastic than that made to whfb. For one, they won’t be destroying the universe and changing the setting. They likely will be progressing the story as they are doing with AOS though. This is both good and bad. It allows gw to release new Miniatures but could mean that some races are destroyed along the way (as the squats were many moons ago). The FAQ does state that all existing races will be in the new system. The same was said in AOS but you can see many of them are being phased out/changed. 

I also believe that AOS was also more aligned with 40k in its phases when launched to allow transition between systems to be more intuitive.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see similar unit cards as per the AOS style. This would be of particular benefit for vehicles which would have masses of wounds and it would replace the current issue with glancing to death.

All this however is speculation. The Warhammer TV Facebook page is doing a live q&a session tonight at 17.15 GMT to further answer some questions. Again this is the ‘new’ GW face as they would never have bothered in the past. The cynic in me does wonder how much different the new edition will be that they are going to this much trouble and considering it is their primary cash cow…