Whfb - Dwarves vs Daemons – part 2 – Neil’s list and Battle Report

At the normal club meet on Friday, I faced off against Neil and his latest Daemon list. Having only received that day, I was unable to write up some thoughts beforehand but I was able to look at it on my lunch briefly to give me an idea of what I was facing. Without further a due, here is his list (and mine can be found here):

Neil’s Khorne based list


Billy the Bloodthirster – Lesser gift (multiple wound 2) – 425pts

Skulltaker – juggernaut, slayer sword, cloak of skulls – 250pts

Herald of Nurgle – bsb, lesser locus of virulence, War banner, palanquin – 240pts


32 Plaguebearers – Full command, Banner of Swiftness – 461pts

10 Bloodletters – Full command – 170pts


4 Bloodcrushers of Khorne – Full command, Razor Standard – 325pts

5 Flesh Hounds of Khorne – 165pts

1 Beast of Nurgle – 60pts

1 Beast of Nurgle – 60pts

1 Beast of Nurgle – 60pts

5 Chaos Furies of Khorne – 70pts

5 Chaos Furies of Khorne – 70pts


Skull Cannon of Khorne – 135pts


Thoughts on his list

I won’t go into a huge amount of depth on his list as didn’t before the game so it is just some initial thoughts on it.

Bloodthirster! I’d never faced one before so was quite excited to see one (though I really didn’t want to get into combat with it….

No Magic! (Yes over use of exclamation marks abound!!!). This is about the first time that i’ve ever seen no magic (normally Lore of Death) in a list Neil’s taken. Sure it invalidates a number of items in my list but that’s always a chance when creating an allcomers list.

Ambushers. His Flesh hounds will have the ability to come on behind my lines, so i’ll have to be careful not to leave any gaps for him to exploit.

In terms of the rest of the list, not much has changed from my initial thoughts. The Skull cannon is a priority for my Cannon and the Furies for the Organ Guns.

Pre-match rolls

The Dwarf hatred roll (setting the tone for the rest of the game) was a one which meant just General vs General.

The Bloodthirsters lesser gift was Cleaving Blow, which gave the Multiple Wounds (2) rule.

For Terrain, we didn’t worry about rolling on the table and just grabbed a couple of woods, a couple of buildings, some obstacles and a hill.

We rolled Meeting Engagement for the scenario and Neil won the choice for sides and picked the side that had the majority of the terrain, figuring he could hide behind most of it.

1. Terrain


As per the rules we rolled off to see what started off the table. In a spectacular display of rolling, Neil had the following start off the table:

Bloodthirster, Herald of Nurgle, 5 Furies (+ his ambushing Flesh Hounds).

Not to be outdone I had to beat him and rolled the following into reserves.

Cannon, 25 Longbeards, 16 Irondrakes, 16 Quarrellers.

This left me with precisely 3 ‘units’ and all my characters to set up initially!

Neil chose to set up all his available units first and placed a lot of them behind buildings. The exceptions were the Plaguebearers, that were put on the table edge so that the Herald could join them when it arrived and the Skull Crushers and Cannon, placed almost at his table edge.

I had an idea of how I wanted to put my battle line in order to maximise ‘bubbles’ and put everything on the base line so that from turn 2, my other units would come on into that setup. This was my first and the most costly error of the game as it meant the Organ Guns were effectively out of play for the entire game!

2. Deployment

img_31032. Deployment - Dwarf4. Deployment - Daemons5. Deployment - Daemons3. Deployment - all

Turn 1 – Daemons

In the only action of the turn, the skull cannon shot at one of the Organ Gun, killing 2 on the crew and damaging the fine machine. Burrnoth could only watch helplessly as the daemons taunted him, knowing that he was unable to retaliate.

The Bloodletters controlling their killing instinct, sloped off into the nearby tower raising the blood standard from the parapets.

3. Turn 1 Daemons

6. Turn 1 - Daemons

Turn 1 – Dwarves

With the majority of the enemy out of range, the two engineers turned their charges to the daemons in the nearby building. In a display of complete ineptitude, both machines manged to misfire and fire just 2 shots each resulting, as you might have expected, in zero hits.

4. Turn 1 Dwarf

Turn 2 – Daemons

Some of the Daemons started to move towards the dwarf side of the table but there was no sign of their reinforcements bar a unit of ambushing hounds that appeared on one flank of the Dwarf lines.

The enemy cannon once again fired, this time finishing what it started and destroying the Organ gun. Burrnoth could only watch, with impotence at the Daemons capering about on top of the infernal machine.

5. Turn 2 Daemons

Turn 2 – Dwarves

With the sound of horns and beat of drums, the dwarf reinforcements marched up to join the battle line.

The remaining Organ Gun turned toward the Chaos Hounds and obliterated the warped dogs in a single round of shooting.

The Valkyrie, moved forward and shot the nearest Beast of Nurgle. The boiling steam proving too much for it’s regenerative powers to overcome.

6. Turn 2 Dwarf

8. Turn 1 - Dwarves9. Turn 1 - Dwarves

Turn 3 – Daemons

With a terrible roar, that shock the battlefield, Billy the Bloodthirster announced his arrival. The other unit of furies swarmed round him. With much less fanfare, the Herald directed his palanquin to join the unit of plaguebearers.

With the unit of hounds destroyed and the second Gyro now a threat, the advanced unit of Furies retreated behind the bloodletter controlled tower and the 2 Beasts of Nurgle also withdrew back towards the wood.

Rot, Glorious Rot blossomed over the field of battle and the Valkyrie was the recipient taking damage as parts of the machine rusted away.

The Skullcannon continued it’s grow it’s tally of dwarven warmachines, this time adding the Cannon, Lizardbane, to it’s list. Burrnoth could only watch, his rage growing, as the Daemons danced in glee at the destruction wrought.

7. Turn 3 Daemons

11. Turn 3 - Daemons

Turn 3 – Dwarves

Burrnoth ordered the quarrellers to move up at maximum speed trying to get their crossbows in range of something. The Valkyrie flew at the double to the blindside of the plaguebearer unit (in the process forgetting to unload it’s compliment of bombs). The other Gyro moved up (hiding behind the side of the building) to threaten the 2 Beasts of Nurgle.

The Irondrakes and remaining Organ gun fired at the only only available target, the Bloodletters, completely failing to hit anything in the process.

8. Turn 3 Dwarf

12. Turn 3 - Dwarves13. Turn 3 - Dwarves

Turn 4 – Daemons

The Daemon flying wing, consolidated together and advanced down the edge of the board. Seeing the bellowing greater daemon and it’s lesser com padres looking at him, the Dwarf Gyro sudden felt an overwhelming urge to be somewhere else at that point.

The unit of plaguebearers advanced now their Herald was present and the nearby Beast moved to intercept the Valkyrie.

The Skullcannon completed it’s task as it removed the final Organ Gun making it 3 for 3.

9. Turn 4 Daemons

14. Turn 4 Daemons

Turn 4 – Dwarves

The Gryo flew over the Bloodthirster and Furies that had been threatening it and shot into the swarm, taking down one of their number.

The Irondrakes managed to succeed where the Organ Guns hadn’t and finally killed one of the Bloodletters hiding in the nearby tower.

The Valkyrie, dodging the obvious trap the daemons had set, and was able to continue it’s harrassment of Nurgles children taking off another of them.

The Quarrellers and 2 blocks of dwarf warriors started to advance towards the Daemons.

10. Turn 4 Dwarf


Turn 5 – Daemons

The Skull Cannon decided to, this time, target the Gyro harassing the Furies but in a break from the run of play, failed to wound it.

The Plaguebearers continued their advance towards the dwarf lines whilst the beast continued to try and limit the Valkyries movements.

The flying swarm, backed up by the remaining 2 Beasts, moved round the building and were now in a position to threaten the dwarf lines.

11. Turn 5 Daemons


17. Turn 5 Daemons

Turn 5 – Dwarves

The dance of the Valkyrie continued and it was able to get behind the plaguebearer unit and unleashed the full power of it’s steam gun into them killing six of the damned. The quarrellers also targeted the unit but the range was against them and only one of the gruesome Daemons fell to the volley.

The Irondrakes, performing a quick reform, targeted the Bloodthirster, burning a wound from it.

12. Turn 5 Dwarf

Turn 6 – Daemons

The two Beasts of Nurgle, two units of Furies and Bloodthirster all attempted to charge the Irondrakes but with the Rune of the Standard blazing brightly, only one unit of Furies made it in. The Bloodthirster bellowed in frustration as it took another wound in the process. In the resultant combat, the Furies failed to kill any of the dwarves, who killed one in return and two more of them were sucked back into the realm of Chaos as the units grasp on stability failed.

On the other flank, the Plaguebearers also failed to charge the Longbeards in front of them.

The Skull Cannon tried to target the BSB in the Hammerers but the shot fell short and plowed into the ground a few feet short of them.

13. Turn 6 Daemons

18. Turn 6 Daemons

Turn 6 – Dwarves

The Quarrellers and Valkyrie again combined their fire into the plaguebearers, taking off another complete rank between them.

The other Gyro moved up and killed another fury but they held firm due to the inspiring presence of the General.

In the final move of the game, the Irondrakes killed off the remaining Fury.

14. Turn 6 Dwarf


It was a draw in the end as the BRB states you must have double the victory points of your opponent.

Daemons – 445 VP’s (Organ Gun – 150, Organ Gun – 145, Cannon – 150)

Dwarves – 235 VP’s (Furies – 70, Flesh Hounds – 165).

There were no bonus victory points.


Well that was…interesting.

This was probably the quickest game of 8th either of us had ever played (about 2 hours long, games at the club are often in the region of 3.5 hours – we aren’t the speediest players).

Neil and I felt that the game had been a bit of a non event and were both left wanting. Between half the armies starting off the board, no magic phase, Neil not wanting to bring anything on until the cannon was neutralised and me sitting on the board edge, virtually nothing happened for the entire game. In the final turn where he was in a position to charge, he forgot about the Irondrake’s Rune of Slowness and it prevented him from getting almost everything into combat.

As I stated in the deployment section, probably my one major error was setting the Organ guns up on the base line. I should have set them up far further forward, where they could reach most of the board. Placing them on the edge just meant the skull cannon could pick them off without them doing anything.

I have come to one conclusion, one cannon just isn’t enough. In this type of army I need to include either a second cannon or a Grudge Thrower. My preference would probably be the GT as this would (1) give a template weapon to my arsenal, (2) allow speculative shots to hidden Ironblasters etc. (3) I’ve not used one this edition. I should have come to this decision a while back but in my other games I had been very lucky and normally struck first with my cannon. With a second long range option, I would still be able to strike back in the event the cannon or GT were destroyed. It would likely mean dropping one or both of the Organ guns as i’m coming to the opinion that I prefer the Irondrakes (though I’d always take them and one OG as a preference).

It’s also worth pointing out that in the entire game the Trollhammer failed to hit at all. Showing once again why I never take the damn thing!! (I just can’t make single dice rolls…)

Sods law but this is one game where the MRo Grungni might have come in handy to protect the war machines.

Next up is likely a rematch vs Luke so I need to decide whether to bring the dwarves again or maybe the Wood elves.

WHFB – Dwarves vs Luke’s WoC – part 2 – Battle report

With barely a rumble, the bridge pivoted up to connect to the causeway that extended out from the other side of the vast chasm, running alongside the side of the mountain. The only sign of the massive counter weights and dwarvern mechanisms powering it were the two enormous chains running from the underside of the bridge into darkened recesses within the cliff. As the two sections smoothly came together, the giant gates set back under the overhanging archway, opened and receded into the statues of the ancestor gods that stood on either side. The air was split with the sound of rasping horns and almost immediately, with iron shod boots striking the ground in lockstep, the dwarves appeared from within the depths of the silver capped mountain that gave the hold its name. The throng of Karak Silvertop once more marched to war!

As covered in my last post about the army lists, this week I had the pleasure of facing off against Luke and his oldhammer Warriors of Chaos.

Pre-match rolls and Terrain

With 5 spells to roll for, the Deamon Princes had everything with the exception of Stream of Corruption and Blades of Putrefaction.

The Dwarf hatred roll was against all characters.

The scenario rolled was battleline.


For once we decided to roll everything using the BRB including the terrain and ended up with the following:

Forest (turned out to be a Blood forest)

River (completely forgot to roll for the effects)

Magic circle (MR 2 within 6″), depicted by the blood alter on the map.

Wizards tower (You gain lore master of your chosen lore for the turn).

Building (normal)

Nehekharan Sphinx – If you pass an initiative test you can gain either: HKB, lore master of death or something else that I cannot remember (or be bothered to look up now) for the rest of the game.

We decided that the Sphinx was massively overpowered and that only one death spell could be gained with each test.

I will say, that this is one of the things i really never liked about 8th. Why can’t terrain just be terrain. Why does everything have to have sodding magical properties. It always seemed to be unnecessary and unneeded addition to the game.

As it went all the random terrain was pretty moot, as after I won the roll for sides and we switched over, I promptly stuck the horde of hammerers on the Sphinx to block the prince getting to it and we then proceeded to completely forgot about the terrain special rules!

1. Terrain


I nearly deployed entirely on my left flank to take advantage of the open terrain but with the sphinx dead centre, I wanted to control that and the house was ready made to protect one flank (and more importantly the organ gun) and allowed me to place the quarreller unit in there, so they would not only be able to shoot in any direction without penalty but it would also protect them in combat and give them stubborn. The two hordes were placed front and centre and the Irondrakes were placed to guard the flank.

2. Deployment

1. Deployment

3. Deployment4. Deployment5. Deployment7. Deployment

Turn 1 – WoC

With a great cry, the forces of the dark gods pushed forward on all fronts. The Juggernauts of Khorne showed an amazing amount of restraint, keeping their wits enough to maximise the range of the organ gun.

The prince called on the favor of his deity and the juggers were the recipients, flesh toughening in response. The warriors on the shrines chanted in unison and the eye of the gods turned on their champions with Thrudd’s muscular caricature growing further.

The depraved, twisted cousins of the dwarves goaded their charge to target the hammerers but the enraged daemon broke free of it’s chains, devouring it’s handlers and wounding the nearby daemon prince.

The hammerers watched, unimpressed, as the hail of javelins launched at them all failed to clear the nearby river.

3. Turn 1 WoC

8. Vanguard9. Turn 1 WoC10. Turn 1 WoC

Turn 1 – Dwarves

The gyrocoptors flew towards the large unit of Warriors and although at the maximum distance for their weapons effective range, still managed to roast 5 of the putrescent ones. The irondrakes stepped up and chargrilled 4 of the dogs in front of them, the stench of cooked tainted meat was not enough to send the final member of the pack running though.

The quarrellers in a rare moment of total ineptitude, all targeted the same dog. That dog obviously died, pincusioned with bolts and with their faces flaming behind their beards the crossbow dwarves were glad the walls of the house hid their shame from their brethren.

The crew of the organ gun, seeing the Daemon Prince had been gravely wounded tried some speculative shots to finish off the fell beast but they all went wide of the mark instead shredding the trees surrounding him.

4. Turn 1 Dwarves

11. Turn 1 Dwarf12. Turn 1 Dwarf13. Turn 1 Dwarf

Turn 2 – WoC

The warriors charged into the nearest of the gyro’s and dispite the warped diseases that threatened to twist the flesh of the flyer, he staved them off, striking a warrior down in the process. The experience was unnerving enough that with his machine rusting before his eyes, his nerve broke and he peeled off and made for the hills.

The Maurauder horse and remaining hound attempted to charge the irondrakes but the runes on their standard flared brightly causing both units to stumble and pull up short of their target. Seeing the failure of the nearby units to charge the drakes, Thrudd instead flew across the river to set up a favourable future charge.

On the other side of the river, the dogs failed to charge the organ gun, thus impeding the ability of the Skullcrushers to do anything. Bellowing in frustration they steered their mounts to the side, determined that they would not be denied their tally of skulls.

The Daemon Prince realised staying put was just inviting the artillery to keep targeting him and determined to share the gifts of the allfather, tore into the warrior horde. Four of the brave dwarves fell beneath his claws and a further warrior was shredded from the miscast explosion that also took a further wound from the prince. (Edit: with a single wound now remaining, Luke was now somewhat concerned for the safely of the Prince!)

5. Turn 2 WoC

14. Turn 2 WoC15. Turn 2 WoC17. Turn 2 WoC

Turn 2 – Dwarves

The Gyro finished it’s tactical retreat and once again turned to face the warriors. His squadron partner, used the time to get into a prime position and fired his steam gun at full force. Seven of the Nurgle warriors fell to the ground with the putrid flesh sluiced off their bones as the boiling steam turned the armour into a pressure cookers.

The quarrellers, making up for their early failure, wiped out the remaining dogs, opening up the path for the Organ Gun to then target the Skullcrushers. With typical efficiency the machine cut down one of the monstrous infantry and left a second hanging onto life.

The Hammerers charged into the mauraders who fled, panicking the nearby hound. They then redirected into the trolls who also fled. The Daemon prince continued it’s one man monster crusade of destruction, killing another 5 dwarves and healing a wound in the process.

6. Turn 2 Dwarves

18. Turn 2 Dwarf19. Turn 2 Dwarf20. Turn 2 Dwarf

Turn 3 – WoC

Thrudd and the nearby Warshrine both charged into the Irondrakes. The defensive fire once again proving ineffective against the well armoured BSB. In the ensuing combat the Irondrakes showed their elite status, wounding Thudd and the damaging the warshrine twice for the loss of just two of their number.

The few remaining warriors of Nurgle recharged the damaged Gyro, this time completing what they started and permanently grounding the machine.

The Skullcrushers finally managed to get a charge off, targeting the quarrellers. Much to their frustration they needed to dismount to attack the dwarves and were quickly repulsed from their building assault. The Warshrine supported this by attacking the organ gun and destroying the proud machine. The Prince continued his demolition of the warriors, again gaining a wound but unable to shift the steadfast dwarves.

The marauder horse and single hound continued their run from the battle but the Trolls rallied and turned to face the battlefront.

7. Turn 3 WoC

Turn 3 – Dwarves

In what turned out to be the final turn of the game, the remaining gyrocoptor continued to whittle down the warrior unit, this time taking out just two of them. The Irondrake combat continued with 2 more of the dwarvern elite falling but in return they bought down the enemy BSB and inflicted a further wound on the shrine, that they then proceeded to run down as it fled from the implacable dwarves.

The Prince killed off a handful of the stout warriors and they failed to inflict any damage in return.

Throgg and the Trolls once again fled from the attention of the Hammerers, who pulled up just inside the woods

8. Turn 3 Dwarves


Running out of time and with so little of the battle played, very little destruction had been achieved. I’d lost my Organ Gun (145pts) and a Gyrocoptor (80pts) and Luke had lost his BSB (241pts), a warshrine (135pts), the hellcannon (210pts) and a pack of dogs (30pts) which, when also factoring in the bonus 50VPs from killing the BSB, gave me a 666 to 225 victory.


On the drive back we had a chat about how we thought the rest of the battle might have played out. We agreed that the Irondrakes killing the bsb and the shrine had given me the edge.

On the left flank, the Warriors were in real trouble, they could have retreated but the Irondrakes would have been able to move across and finish them off (perhaps with the assistance of the Gyro)

It the centre, the hammerers would probably have done a swift reform and moved to attack the Prince in turn 5. If the Warriors were able to hold for another turn or two (which should have been possible due to steadfast) it would ensure the prince was held which should have allowed this. This would have likely resulted in a dead prince. However the nearby shrine might have been able to charge the dwarf Warriors (though I would have used my engineer to try and delay this), which could have swung the combat allowing the prince to avoid the hammerers. Either way the Dwarf Warriors survivability was looking as likely as their chaotic compadres. 

The juggernaut riders could possibly have finished off the quarrellers but with steadfast and Lukes rolls, they likely would have taken all game to do so (especially as the xbow dwaves wouldn’t have to initiate combat in their turn).

I forget how psychological this game can be, especially if you haven’t faced a specific unit before. For Luke it was the Hammerers, he was trying to avoid it (successfully) at all costs. For me it was Throgg and the Trolls. I’ve seen Luke roll a phenomenal number of saves before so that regen was really worrying me.

In terms of the list, it played reasonably well. The ease in which Luke avoided the hammerers just bought to the forefront the major weakness with Dwarf armies, their movement and as such when taking large blocks of troops you need to ensure the options for the enemy are all bad (or that there isn’t one option that is better than another). In hindsight this meant that I should have put at least the lord in the warriors as he would have bolstered the weaker unit making neither of them a good prospect to attack.

The two Runesmiths, Banner of Valaya and 2 dispel scrolls really helped contain the magic phase and the banner especially, gave me a massive  edge vs the bound warshrine spells. As it went I only used one of the dispel scrolls in the last turn and probably wouldn’t have bothered doing so if it hadn’t been the last turn.

My unit of the match was definitely the Gyrocoptors that between them they killed off 14 of the Warriors, though my Irondrakes were probably a close second once again proving their worth.

My next match may be against Luke using a full gunline but I also know that Neil is interested in a game too.

2. Deployment


WHFB – Dwarves vs Luke’s WoC – part 1 – lists and thoughts.

With the completion of my KOW group games and the new edition of 40k not out until June, I thought i’d try and get in a few games of whfb.


Like me, Luke was a former player who took a break (you can see from the pictures in this post that his figures are very much oldhammer and I love his banners) and came back to warhammer late in the day so both of us are still very much into 8th ed. As such I proposed a series of games against him and having multiple armies I asked him what he had never played in 8th. Of the one’s easily to hand, it was Dwarves and Wood Elves. In order to give him a competitive game I said i’d bring Dwarves to start with and then later on i’d give wood elves a go (and offered him the use of any of my armies for the evening, if he wanted to try something else). Having decided the race, I then offered him the choice of what sort of army he wanted to face: Full gunline, all melee or combined arms. He wanted to try a bit of everything for the first game (and as we were playing a series of games, I could bring something different next time). So with that said (and after some good advice from the EEFL forum – which of course I then mainly ignored ;p), I decided on the following list:

The Throng of Karak Silvertop

Characters – 658pts

Knoffles Silvertop – (General) Lord – Shieldbearers + GW + Ro Fortitude + 2 * Ro Iron – 271pts

Drugin Silvertop – (BSB) Thane – MRo Gromril + GW – 126pts

Harek Silvertop – Runesmith – Ro Stone + Ro Spellbreaking + Shield – 93pts

Barlin Silvertop – Runesmith – Ro Stone + Ro Spellbreaking + Ro Furnace + Shield – 98pts

Burrnoth Strongarm – Master Engineer – 70pts

Core – 626pts

Quarrellers (14) – Standard + GW – 205pts

Dwarf Warriors (39) – FC + GW – 420pts

Special – 749pts

Hammerers (36) – Musician + Standard + Ro Valaya – 589pts

Gyrocoptor – 80pts

Gyrocoptor – 80pts

Rare – 465pts

Irondrakes (17) – FC + Brace of Drakeguns + Ro Slowness – 320pts

Organ gun – Ro Accuracy – 145pts

List thoughts

Though there are elements of what i would normally include the build is somewhat different in order to give Luke a flavor of different dwarf options.

Although I love the model and this is my preferred build if I take him, I would not normally take a dwarf lord, if only because for the points I could fit in another unit! He is however great fun and is the head of Karak Silvertop so for fluff I love taking him in lists (and he is amazingly tanky and it will give Luke a chance to play against him). This build gives him a 2+ armour save, 4 str 6 attacks (and 2 str 4 attacks) and a toughness of 7 with 6 wounds. Almost monster stats, all in someone that still maintains the lookout sir rule!

The two Runesmiths are often staples and with the BSB are known to Dwarf players as the holy trinity. I’ve kept them as bare minimum build so they have a 2+ save and a ‘dispel rune’ each.

I’ve gone for a BSB build I don’t normally take as I wanted to try it out. I have been taking the MRo Grungni because as standard, that gives him a 4+ ward (with a 3+ armour save) and a 5+ ward vs shooting for anything within 6″. I found that this was quite situational so decided to keep him cheap and quite hitty with a 1+ armour save and great weapon. I did toy with giving him a Ro Iron to add another wound but taking more characters than normal meant I tried to keep loadouts at a minimum.

The Master Engineer I would normally give a BoP and Ro Stone but again with points restrictions he is being fielded as standard. I nearly dropped him but with only 1 warmachine in the list, I wanted to maximise it’s potential and use him as a guard.

I’ve fielded shield beards as an anvil recently (mainly as the models were painted) with mixed success, however I decided their defensiveness wasn’t good enough and neither was the damage output. I have found that 8th seems to be more about damage output and so this left me with a dilemma. Having decided I wanted to take a horde, did I take a horde of GW longbeards (this comes to almost 625 on the nose), Warriors or Quarrellers. In the end I went with GW warriors as I have previously taken a horde of Quarrellers (so wanted to try something different) and also it allowed me to include a small unit of quarrellers anyway to make up the core tax and to counter any chaff. It’s worth noting that due to the poor initiative of dwarves, taking great weapons doesn’t really impact them as you normally strike last anyway.

I produced a gzillion lists in the run up to the game (it’s one of the elements that is head and shoulder above KOW) but decided that I wanted to bring a horde of hammerers. The potential damage output of this unit is obscene with 40 str 6 attacks (or str 7 if you charge). I’ve given them the magic banner with Ro Valaya so that, as standard, I am always dispelling on a +4 (or as a lvl 4 wizard lord equivalent). It also allows any remains in play spells to be dispelled on a 3+ each turn. This combined with the 2 channel attempts and 2 dispel runes means it should help to tie down the magic phase.

2 Gyro’s round out the special choices as they are fantastic chaff and the 2 flame templates will mince large low toughness units.

As i’ve stated before, Irondrakes are one of my favorite units and work as both an anvil and highly effective shooting unit (especially with the Ro Slowness). This is one of the reasons I will now rarely take shield dwarves.

The final element of the army is my single warmachine, an organ gun. It has a single Ro Accuracy, which when combined with the Engineer will give it a standard 2+ to hit, or 3+ at long range (15-30″). Added to the ME artillery dice reroll ability should make this pretty effective (assuming I roll well on the 2 art’ dice and it isn’t killed in a turn or 2).

I consider this a true dwarf combined arms list rather than a gunline. Yes it does have a number of shooting units and the number may be greater than other armies but for dwarves this is almost a minimum and only one warmachines is practically unheard of! I’m sure i’ll regret not taking a cannon but this list is not about warmachines. I’ll leave them for another day when I don’t take the lord and so have more points to spend.

The hammerer unit will go front and centre with the lord and bsb in it. The Irondrakes will be set up forward and will do their normal retreat each turn to try and maximise their shooting. Their priority will be the trolls. The quarrellers will likely be to one side of the hammerers (or GW dwarves) and will aiming to remove all chaff. If they are attacked, one of the hordes can counter (though with their stand and shoot and GW’s, they should be able to hold their own somewhat).


Luke’s Warriors of Chaos list

Nurgle Daemon Prince – level 4 Lore of nurgle, flight, chaos armour, charmed shield, sword of striking, dragonbane gem, scaled skin, soul feeder, Chaos familiar – 525pts

Exalted hero (bsb) – Disc of tzeentch, halberd, enchanted shield, MoT, tzeentch third eye – 241pts

Throgg – 195pts

5 chaos hounds – 30pts

5 chaos hounds – 30pts

21 Chaos Warriors of Nurgle – FC, MoN, halberd, banner of swiftness – 444pts

5  Chaos trolls – additional hand weapons – 190pts

Marauder horse – champion, standard, javelins, flails – 110pts

Warshrine – MoT – 135pts

Warshrine – MoT – 135pts

Hellcannon – 210pts

3 Skullcrushers – champion, standard, ensorcelled weapons – 254pts


When he sent it through, he said he wanted to try a double shrine list and the only point of the shrine is to maximise the chances of good rolls on the eye of the gods table and it also has a bound spell that allows D3 eligible characters/champs within 12″ to roll on it when cast. This explains the number of unit champions. I’m not sure if two is over kill though.

He also stated that he wanted to try Lore of nurgle rather than death. The lore is a good all round one. There are no terrible spells but it does also lack a killer spell too.  I will need to be careful of curse of the leper, as that spell reduces toughness which is one of my strengths. One of the spells also increases the regen save by +1 which would be filth on the trolls.

He also got caught out on blood and glory in the recent comp and so has ensured banners in every unit.

I’m also not sure if he has taken a prince before. If he has, he must have been quite lucky as 8th is often a cannon heavy meta and it is not well protected against them. As I don’t have one, I will have to contend with a 1+, 5++ (2++ vs fire). Knows 5 spells, channels on a 5+. Flies. Hits everything in my army on a 2+ and is at -1 to hit (so everything in my army hits on a minimum of 5+) and he regains wounds on a 6 in combat. Frankly this is a beast, though is over a fifth of his points in one model so it has to be high on the list to kill. *sigh* where’s my cannon. 

He also included the standard unkillable (although surprising killable) bsb, with a 1+ (3+ in combat), 3++ save (rerolling ward rolls of 1). I do think that the discs have to be the most under-priced mount in the game (well with perhaps the exception of the shieldbearers).

I’ve not faced Throgg before but he will obviously be going in the troll unit which makes that my number one target for the irondrakes. If they get some hits then the organ gun will be tasked with finishing them off (if it is still there, as it’s primary target has to be the prince and Luke has to be thinking that the organ needs to be gotten rid of early).

He has 3 sets of chaff and the quarrellers will be aiming for them asap with priority going to the unit nearest the organ gun (with perhaps the mauraders first if possible of only due to it having a champion).

 The gyros will generally be a nuisance but will primarily try and tie down the hell cannon as that could mince my large blocks.
And with all that said, I decided to post this early and give him a heads up in case he happens to read this before Friday. I’m nice like that.

KOW – Herd of Khazbar vs Alex’s Elves – SELWG Competition game

My final game of the group stage was vs Alex Mountain and his Elves. I’ve faced Alex a couple of times before at Warhammer and he can be a canny opponent. He was particularly good at using Chaff in that system, so I was expecting this to carry over to this one.

Alex’s Elf list – 2000pts

Kindred Archer Horde – Brew of Keen Eyedness – 295pts

Kindred Archer Horde – Jar of Four Winds – 285pts. (They may look suspiciously like unpainted 5th edition Bretonnians in the pictures but Alex assured me that yes they were in fact elves, with extra large sunhats on. It was funny but in the course of the game he had to explain this to 4 or 5 others who for some inexplicable reason had come to the same conclusion as me).

Hunters of the Wild Troop – 135pts

Hunters of the Wild Troop – 135pts

Kindred Tallspears Troop – 100pts

Silverbreeze Cavalry Troop – Brew of haste – 160pts

Stormwind Cavalry Troop – Diadem of Dragon-kind – 170pts

Stormwind Cavalry Troop – Potion of the Caterpillar – 160pts

Bolt Thrower – 90pts

Dragon Kindred Lord – Ensorcelled Armour – 345pts (Again this in no way looked the slightest bit like a Zombie Dragon with an undead rider but instead completely resembled a haughty elf riding his noble dragon).

Mounted Mage – Inspiring Talisman – 125pts

As normal I’ll take a look at his units and then try and see if I can guess his deployment.

His entire army has elite, allowing him to re-roll 1’s on the hit roll. This is possibly one of my favourite army wide rules.

Horde of Archers – With 20 attacks, hitting on 4+ and a standard 24″ range, these will project a solid area of denial. One of the units will have a range of 36″ due to the Jar and the other will hit on 3+.  I won’t lie, these do worry me somewhat as if they focus on the same target, they will be deleting units pretty quickly,

Bolt Thrower – I’ve found bolt throwers hit and miss with just 2 attacks. They do have a 48″ range so will be threatening my forces from the first turn. Their piercing is somewhat wasted on my army so overall i’m not too fussed about this unit.

Silverbreeze Cavalry – This is the last of his ranged units and what he would have used as chaff in the previous system. With the brew of haste it would have a range of 11″, the most of any unit on the field. They also have nimble and bows so they could easily delete my chaff from the get go and start chipping away at other units/get in the way. They are a prime target for my limited ranged units.

Hunters of the Wild – This unit pumps out a lot of attacks for their size and with Vanguard, they could potentially be in my face really early on and he has 2 of them. They do need to attack first as with their low nerve (10/12), they’ll die to a stiff breeze. They are also a prime target for my Chieftains ranged attack as even a few wounds could remove them.

Kindred Tallspears – This unit is probably the closet to chaff in his list in terms of points. I suspect their sole use is to get in the way of anyone going for his hordes.

Stormwind Cavalry – The troops only have 8 attacks but hit on a 3+ with TC (2) and have a def of 5+. Again the nerve is low at 11/13. He will definitely be wanting to get these guys in the flank to maximise their potential. One of them also has a breath attack (10) which can so some damage.

Mounted Mage – This guy is fairly bare bones with heal (3) and Bane Chant (2). I think his primary job is to buff the 2 hordes.

Dragon Kindred Lord – another filthy flyer 😉 with ensorcelled armour. I just need to try and ensure he doesn’t get behind my lines.

This is the most amount of shooting i’ve come up against so far, so it will be a good experience for me. I would expect the Archer hordes to make up the centre of the lines with maybe the bolt thrower in between them. The mage will likely be nearby to throw on a bane chant.

Everything in his army, with the exception of the 2 hordes and the Dragon Lord, have a top nerve of 13 or less so should be easy to remove.

He also has the same number of drops as my list (11).

To recap my list.

The Herd of Khazbar the Reborn – 2000pts

Khazbar – Shaman – heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed – Shaman – heal – 120pts

Zurrock the Mighty – Chieftain on Chariot – bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers – Horde – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Stampede – Horde – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes – Horde – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Brutox – 220pts

Brutox – 220pts


We rolled map pack 5, from  Neil’s terrain generator, which gave us 4 buildings, a wood, a hill and 24 inches of obstacles. After deployment it looked like this:

1 Terrain

1 Terrain

Scenario and Deployment

The game was Dominate which was nice, as I hadn’t played this yet and due to the fortuitous placement of the woods, might give me an edge with my army wide pathfinder.

Alex won the roll for sides and the armies after deployment looked like this. (his right most hunters vanguarded up to the wall and those on the other side of his lines moved up to the building.

2 Deployment

2 Deployment Herd3 Deployment Elves4 Deployment Elves5 Deployment all

He then won the roll for first turn which he took.

Turn 1 – Elves

The Elven right flank surged forward with the hunters, Stormwind Cavalry and his Dragon Lord making the most of the lack of Herd on that side of the board. There was little movement on the other side of the board with the exception of the Silverbreeze that moved to cover the nearby heavy cavalry.

His massed shooting opened up, the herd lines withered under the deluge of arrows with one of the beast packs left as a pincushion.

3 Turn 1 Elves

7 Turn 1 Elves

8 Turn 1 Elves9 Turn 1 Elves

Turn 1 – Herd

Zurrock seeing an early chance in the game, unleashed the Brutox and he charged in alongside to wipe out the Silverbreeze Cavalry. Unable to contain its bloodlust, the Brutox overran towards the Stormwind who had been cowering behind.

In the centre the Stampede forced the longhorns forward to act a emergency chaff. The brutes also moved up to take advantage of the cover.

The Spirit Walkers, their numbers replenished by the duel heal thrown on them, swung round to join the Brutox in forming a new battle line to tackle the Elven flanking force (conveniently making sure the dragon couldn’t get behind the lines).

4 turn 1 herd

10 Turn 1 Herd13 Turn 1 Herd12 Turn 1 Herd11 Turn 1 Herd

Turn 2 – Elves

The rain of Arrows continued with the remaining beast pack doing its job and ensuring more valuable targets were spared. The Longhorns were subject to the brunt of the shooting and failed to survive the fire. The Herd ranks were starting to thin rapidly.

Faced with a slavering monster, unable to escape its charge arc and with no ranged support to help them, the heavy cavalry realised they were going to have to do more than just posture. They swallowed deeply, charged in and managed to waver it. It was hard to tell if the horses or elves were the more terrified of what was sure to occur next, with all eyes rolling and the whites showing.

The flanking force moved up to form a coherent line with the lord on dragon showing what dastardly underhanded tactics the elves would stoop to by flying forward and fitting into the smallest possible gap between the table edge and the flank of the Brutox.

5 turn 2 elves

14 Turn 2 Elves
Remember, NOT a Zombie Dragon!

15 Turn 2 Elves

16 Turn 2 Elves
The bottom horde of archers thought that no-one would notice that were Bretonnians if they stayed as far away from the action as possible.

17 Turn 2 Elves

Turn 2 – Herd

The Brutox, ignoring it’s waver, and Chieftain charged into the Stormwind Cavalry and barely raised a claw in anger before the Elves ran off the table. The Blood drunk monster regenerating as it savored it’s first taste of elf.

Knowing that their lines were in trouble due to the position of the Dragon, the left flank pushed up aggressively with the Brutox covering the rear of the Spirit Walkers (this was one situation where the oversized base actually worked in my favour!).

In the centre, the Guardian Brutes moved into the forest followed closely by Khazbar. Wazzock stayed with the Stampede, remaining out of the range of the nearest horde.

6 turn 2 herd

18 Turn 3 Herd19 Turn 3 Herd20 Turn 3 Herd21 Turn 3 Herd

Turn 3 – Elves

The hunters that were still hiding in the eves of the large tower, spun round as the recognised the threat that was rapidly approaching from the other side of the buikdings. The Elven Phalanx moved over to block any potential charge from the Stampede, now that the hunters had been re-tasked. This move also opened up the firing lanes for the two hordes to target the Guardian Brutes but the cover impeded their aim and the damage for fairly insignificant. The Bolt thrower had but one option and shot into the writhing mass of animals making up the stampede.

On the other flank, the Hunters and Stormwind combined to charge the Spirit Walkers felling half their number. Despite, in a move reeking of fear, charging the Brutox in the flank, the Dragon rider failed to remove it.

7 turn 3 elves

Turn 3 – Herd

Zurrock and accompanying Brutox (who continued to regen), finished their flanking maneuver and moved up to now threaten the Elven shooters.

The Spirit Walkers, blood raised, counter charged the hunters and made short work of them. The Brutox also counter-charged but into the Dragon causing a few wounds but more importantly disordering it (I cunningly also forgot to roll to regen the 10 wounds on it – probably as we forgot to mark the wounds up!).

In the centre, Khazbar invoked the power of his amulet, first healing and then bane-chanting the Brutes. They then stormed into the flank of the Spear elves and that fight was only ever going to go one way. The Stampede and Wazzock then moved up in support. The Herd were now threatening the elven shooters that had caused so much damage early on.

8 turn 3 herd

Turn 4 – Elves

The remaining Hunter troop moved to block the herd charging the flank of the shooters.

The Stormwind and Dragon Lord both charged into their respective targets (Spirit Walkers and Brutox) and both units were removed as a consequence (Alex, ever the gent, did say I could roll the regen when we realised there were no wound counters on the model and it hadn’t been done but I refused as it was a comp game and frankly that will teach me for not remembering my own armies rules!)

9 turn 4 elves                                      .

22 Turn 4 Elves23 Turn 4 Elves

Turn 4 – Herd

Eager to clear a path to the hordes of archers that had killed so many of their herd, the chieftain and Brutox tore through the hunters that stood in their path.

Wazzock cast a heal on the Stampede before sending it forward where it crashed into the nearest archers. Elven bodies were pulped under the crushing bodies and despite cowering in the mud, their mettle held under the gaze of the nearby mage and they held their ground.

10 turn 4 herd

Turn 5 – Elves

Realising that they needed to support their brethren in the centre, the Bretonnians Elven archers marched forward with all haste. The mage also moved up.

The Dragon Lord and Stormwind cavalry both moved up to the woods and rather than engage in honorable combat they both used their breath weapons to torch the woods. As Khazbar looked to be burnt to a crisp, their was a flash of green and he disappeared.

11 turn 5 elves

24 Turn 5 Elves

Turn 5 – Herd

The Stampede again charged the archers and this time their nerve broke and they fled from the field. The Brutox then proceeded to trample the bolt thrower and crew into the ground.

Zurrock moved towards the centre ready to contest it.

12 turn 5 herd

Turn 6 – Elves

The remaining archer horde turned and tried to remove the Stampede but the legendary elven archery skill deserted them facing a sea of ferocious animals.

The Dragon Lord, mage and Stormwind Cavalry all moved in to contest the centre of the battlefield.

13 turn 6 elves

Turn 6 – Herd

In the final turn of the game, the remaining herd units rushed towards the centre of the board. Zurrock charged the Dragon Lord, inflicting minor injuries and Wazzock moved up to support.

14 turn 6 elves

25 End of Game


Alex won having the requisite 200pt advantage in the centre circle (640pts vs 325pts). The Stampede was not able to get entirely into the centre circle so did not count towards the total.
In terms of kill points, Alex and his sleazy, untrustworthy elves, back stabbed 1150pts of the noble Herd, whilst the Khazbar eradicated 1075pts of the elven vermin.
(Herd Remaining: Shaman – 120 + Stampede – 305 + Chieftain – 205 + Brutox 220 = 850)
(Elves Remaining: Archer Horde (jar) – 285 + Stormwind Cav (Diadem) – 170 + Dragon Lord – 345 + Mage – 125 = 925).


I always really enjoy my games against Alex, they are normally close run affairs and this was no exception. During the game there was tension, beaded sweat on brows, swearing (that was me), disgraceful dancing with glee (that was me again), instant karma (due to the aforementioned dancing) and a good amount of laughs.

I made some errors straight off the bat on this. I should have deployed one set of buildings more in the centre of the board as this would have obstructed the lanes of fire. I guess i’d been caught out before with obstacles and the impact of crossing them whilst facing archers, so didn’t want them to impede my movement. I was reasonably happy with my deployment though.

Probably my greatest mistake was moving up in the centre way too early. If i’d either set up further back or retreated in the opening move, it would have limited the early shooting and thus the units killed off and might have meant i’d been able to concentrate on the flanking elven force. But more to the point I should have waited until my own flanking force had moved up and was threatening the flank of the archers before moving my forces forward.

Forgetting to role regen on the Brutox when it had suffered 10 wounds was poor and that could have been the difference between that unit dying or lasting another turn.

It is worth mentioning that Alex managed to bane chant one of his archer hordes every single turn on two dice. A feat i’ve not seen or even managed with my 3 dice BC.

As things go that loss is likely to mean a bottom two finish in the group (i’ll probably be fighting the bottom spot with Tony). Neil will probably top it and Dan has a good chance of second though that will likely depend on his match with Alex.

Kill points will decide which 2 runner ups will progress through after the 2 top spots in each group but after my poor first game vs Neil, where I failed to route anything, I seriously doubt i’m in with a chance of scrapping through.


KOW – Herd of Khazbar vs Tony’s Herd – SELWG Competition game

The third of my competition games is perhaps the one I was most looking forward to. This is because it is against the only member of the group that i’ve never played before. It also happens that Tony is the club President so i had to ensure my best behaviour 😉. Tony was also the only other player in the comp’ using the Herd but with different take with his list. I was pleased about that as it gave me a chance to see things in action that I wouldn’t normally take myself.

As normal I’ll start by caveating that any errors in this post are down to my notes and/or memory.

Tony’s Herd List – 2000pts

Great Chieftain – 140pts

Shaman – Heal – 120pts

Shaman – Heal – 120pts

Tribal Warriors – horde – 200pts

Tribal Warriors – horde – 200pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Longhorns – Regiment – Blessing of the gods – 170pts

Tribal Spears – Horde – 205pts

Hunters – Troop – 75pts

Harpies – Troop – 90pts

Guardian Brutes – Regiment – 150pts

Tribal Chariots – Regiment – Potion of the Caterpillar – 160pts

Brutox – 220pts

I’m going to start by looking at the elements that i’ve not seen before.

Tribal Warriors Horde – These look to be a fairly standard horde stats with, high nerve (20/22), melee and def of 4+ and 25 attacks. It also has the army wide TC (1) and pathfinder. This makes it no slouch in combat but nothing out of the ordinary. However he does have two of them!

Tribal Spears Horde – Again the stats are similar with melee/def of 4+. It differs as it has a slightly lower nerve (19/21) more attacks (30) and the Phalanx rule, which negates TC if charged from the front (which will impact most of my units). This makes this unit far more dangerous than the warriors in my eyes (at least to attack) and it’s only 5 more points.

Hunters Troop – This is one of his two chaff units. Hitting on 5’s, doesn’t cause much worry and with a 3+ def and 8/10 nerve they will die to a swift breeze. They do however have vanguard and throwing weapons, so will use this potentially contest objectives and to start chipping away at my units from the word go. They would be dangerous if they hit my own chaff for even a single wound.

Tribal Chariots Regiment – This is the final unit that i’ve not seen/used.  It hits hard on a 3+ with TC (2) and has caterpillar to ensure it retains the TC. It does only have 8 attacks so, like the longhorns, ideally wants to get in a flank. It does have Sp 8 so is his joint 2nd fastest unit (matching the Brutox). Bows does give it a ranged threat but it hits on 5+ so this reduces to a 6 when they move. It also only has a 11/13 nerve and 4+ def so shouldn’t survive much attention.

Great Chieftain – I really want to see how Tony uses this character as I’ve only used the chariot version. He also has a good def (5) and hits reasonably hard (3+ with both CS and TC 1) but only ever with 5 attacks due to being an individual.

Guardian Brutes Regiment – Again this is a unit I use but i’ve never run anything less than a horde so I was curious how differently the regiment would perform. It has half the attacks (12) and a lower nerve (12/15 vs 15/18), which puts it in a similar range as the Longhorns but harder hitting. It retains the def 5 so can absorb hits from the right enemy.

Shaman – Like myself he is running 2 shamans upgraded with heal (5). With inspire and BC (3) as standard they are extremely versatile and I can’t overstate how much I really love these in the support role.

Longhorn Regiments – these elite beastmen hit consistently hard and I’ve found using two regiments as a team work really well, as in this role they act as another horde when attacking.

Harpies – the second of his chaff and I think his most versatile with fly, nimble and vicious (I’m still regretting not taking a unit). If this gets into my backfield it could cause some real issues. In some ways I would prefer it to block me so I could remove it early on.

Brutox – I’ve not made up my mind about the Brutox. I want to love it and my last game showed me its potential but it’s yet to reach it. I have a sneaky suspicion we might be having a ‘Brutox off’ on a flank so I’ll try and swing that in my favour with support.

As normal I wrote this but before the battle and tried to think how I would deploy his army. I’d expect the 2 units of Warriors to form the core of his line and the final horde of Tribal spears to anchor one end. I’d want the longhorns to back these units up and hit flanks where possible to maximise their smaller number of attacks. The Brutox and Chariots i’d put on one flank to cause mischief. Harpies and Hunters would be there to get in the way. I’m not sure where he’d put the Brutes. If I had flyers, then i’m sure either they or one of the Longhorns would be held in reserve. They might anchor the other end of the horde line, with a Longhorn regiment behind them, as their high def should help mitigate any initial damage.

Looking at his list, a number of things immediately jumped out at me. He had almost no magic items and he had a bucket load of infantry units. The three hordes, in themselves would give him a large frontage and combined with the 2 longhorn regiments, would likely cover over half the table making it hard to flank him.

I have to try and flank him though, as even my strongest units will not chew through a horde in a single turn and I have found that  my hordes will generally only survive for 1 or possibly 2 rounds of combat against another horde (the spirit horde really suffers with its low def). Unfortunately he has 2 more drops than I do meaning that it will be that much harder to accomplish.

Quite a few of his units (bar the hordes), do have low nerve, so I might be able to remove them quite quickly.

I also won’t be able to use terrain to my advantage as he has all the same inherent army rules, so I’m going to have to play this one carefully.

My final note to myself is to remember that guardian brutes don’t have pathfinder. I must remember to use them in open ground!!


The Herd of Khazbar the Reborn – 2000pts

Khazbar – Shaman – heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed – Shaman – heal – 120pts

Zurrock the Mighty – Chieftain on Chariot – bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers – Horde – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Stampede – Horde – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes – Horde – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Brutox – 220pts

Brutox – 220pts


We rolled Map pack 6 from Neil’s terrain generator, which contained: 4*tree bases, 2 hills, 2*marsh. I rolled player A and the terrain was set up as follows.

  1. Player A places 4*trees, anywhere on the table except in DZ’s and no nearer than 6” from any table edge & at least 6” apart.
  2. Player B places 2*marsh in any DZ at least 9” from any table edge. Both can be in the same DZ.
  3. Player A places 1 hill anywhere on the table 9” from any table edge.
  4. Player A places 1 hill anywhere on the table 9” from any table edge.

1 Terrain


The terrain was so evenly placed that we kept sides but Tony won the roll so started to deploy first. I kept to my pre-game deployment strategy (which was slightly different to the last game).

I won the first turn roll and elected to go first.

2 Deployment

1 Deployment - Herd of Khazbar2 Deployment - herd of Khazbar3 Deployment - herd of Khazbar4 Deployment - Tony's Herd5 Deployment - Tony's Herd6 Deployment - Overall

Turn 1 – Herd of Khazbar

With a loud bray, Khazbar signaled his forces to move forward. The centre advanced carefully with right flank being more aggressive. The Brutox on the left flank advanced using wood to shield it, backed up by the chief, who shot a few wounds on the nearest warrior horde.

3 Turn 1 - Mark Herd

7 - Turn 1 - Herd of Khazbar8 - Turn 1 - Herd of Khazbar9 - Turn 1 - Herd of Khazbar

Turn 1 – Tony’s Herd

The enemy forces mirrored Khazbar’s approach and also advanced cautiously in the centre. The Brutox cleared the wood and positioned to force an action from Zurrock and his supporting Brutox next turn. The Harpies flew up the other side of the wood to also threaten their flank.

On the other side of the battlefield, the hunters launched their axes at the the stampede causing some flesh wounds.

The Chariots then charged the beast pack, their scythes cutting the dogs to pieces and the steel rims of the wheels grinding the corpses into the mud.

4 Turn 1 - Tony Herd

10 - Turn 1 - Tony's Herd11 - Turn 1 - Tony's Herd

Turn 2 – Herd of Khazbar

In a preemptive strike on the left flank, the Brutox and Chieftain struck at the enemy Brutox softening it up.

The beast pack moved up to block the left most warrior horde, preventing it from supporting the Brutox or charging the Longhorns who had moved up to both avoid the Harpies and threaten the flank of the Brutox.

On the other flank the Stampede and Brutox obliterated the Chariots that faced them. The Brutox was unable to contain its fury and swept towards the Longhorn regiment that had moved up to support them.

5 Turn 2 - Mark Herd

12 - Turn 2 - Herd of Khazbar13 - Turn 2 - Herd of Khazbar14 - Turn 2 - Herd of Khazbar

Turn 2 – Tony’s Herd

The Brutox counter charged into the Chieftain but bounced after causing minimal wounds despite the bane chant that had swelled it’s muscles beyond their normal size. The Harpies continued to move round the wood so that they were now threatening the rear of Khazbar’s lines.

The Tribal Warriors steamrollered the blocking Beast Pack in short order, ready to assist the nearby Brutox.

The Elite Longhorns charged the Brutox on the far flank hoping to remove it. In that, they failed, but in a shocking turn of events the nearby troop of hunters charged the flank of the Stampede and wavered them showing up the cream of the Herd army. The Elites scowled at the hunters. The little runts would have to be slapped back into line later in case they forgot their place!

6 Turn 2 - Tony Herd

15 - Turn 2 - Tony's Herd16 - Turn 2 - Tony's Herd17 - Turn 2 - Tony's Herd

Turn 3 – Herd of Khazbar

Zurrock ordered his mount to re-engage the enemy Brutox. Assisted by a fresh charge from the raging giant next to him, they finally bought low the enemy Brutox. Zurrock then pulled sharply on his reins wheeling round to face the imminent attack of the Harpies.

Khazbar’s Longhorns and the horde of ravening Spirit Walkers both charged into the nearest Warrior horde and taking an affront to their unpainted nature, tore straight through them. The remnants quickly ran off the field of battle.

The Brutox on the far flank continued the war of attrition with the elite Longhorns.

7 Turn 3 - Mark Herd

Turn 3 – Tony’s Herd

The enemy hordes chose this moment to attack. The second warrior horde, seeking revenge hit the Spirit Walkers. Only the fearless nature of their foes prevented their destruction. The Spear Warriors also charged but targeted the Guardian Brute horde. Their lack of Crushing Strength or Thunderous charge prevented many wounds getting through the Guardian’s armour.

The Chief and the Harpies combined to try and remove Zurrock and despite causing damage, only wavered him. They were supported by the Longhorns who put a number of wounds on the Brutox.

The other unit of Elite Longhorns had more luck than their compatriots and bought low the other Brutox. The hunters, remembering they were not meant to do anything useful, missed the writhing mass of creatures two foot in front of them with all the weapons thrown in that direction!

8 Turn 3 - Tony Herd

18- Turn 3 - Tony's Herd19 - Turn 3 - Tony's Herd20 - Turn 3 - Tony's Herd

Turn 4 – Herd of Khazbar

Along the line, the Herd counter-charged where possible. The Brutox continued the fight with the enemy longhorns, regenerating wounds in the process. Khazbar’s elite warriors charged the Chieftain in an attempt to remove him and overrun to support the Brutox. Despite causing significant damage he gained inspiration from the nearby troops and held his ground.

Khazbar looked at Wazzock and they combined their healing to remove almost all the damage previously caused to the Spirit Horde. The revitalised horde then tore apart the enemy warriors infront of them. Khazbar then invoked the power of his amulet and cast bane chant on the Guardian Brutes to assist their ongoing combat with the Phalanx of spears.

Feeling outnumbered and taking advantage of the Hunters inability to have caused any nerve checks in the previous turn, they smashed apart the elite Longhorns and turned to face the remaining enemy on that side of the table looking to get some payback for the earlier cowardly flank charge. At this point the Hunters started to look rather worried.

9 Turn 4 - Mark Herd

21 - Turn 4 - Herd of Khazbar22 - Turn 4 - Herd of Khazbar23 - Turn 4 - Herd of Khazbar

Turn 4 – Tony’s Herd

With their numbers thinning, Tony’s forces tried to even the odds. The Chief and Harpies again tried to take down Zurrock and even with the Chief fluffing his atttacks, they again wavered him. Likewise, the Brutox was on the receiving end of the Longhorns attack but shrugged off the attacks.

The Regiment of Minotaurs that had been lurking in the back field, finally had a clear path and snorting and bellowing they crashed into the spirit walkers but were unable to break them due to the earlier healing.

The spears continued to target the Guardian Brute horde and were able to waver them in the process.

The two shamans each threw heals out. One to the Longhorns and the other to the Spears.

10 Turn 4 - Tony Herd

24 - Turn 4 - Tony's Herd25 - Turn 4 - Tony's Herd26 - Turn 4 - Tony's Herd

Turn 5 – Herd of Khazbar

In the decisive turn of the game, Khazbar’s forces stuck a number of fatal blows.

The Stampede secured the right flank (we just rolled the nerve test for the hunters due to their low nerve and number of attacks coming their way).

The Spirit Walker Horde and Guardian Brutes (Stone beating scissors Fury countering Waver) did enough damage to remove both their respective foes (Minotaurs and Spear Warriors).

The Longhorns took down the Chief and overran into Tony’s remaining Longhorn regiment and this combined with the counter charge from the Brutox (who continued to regenerate) sealed their fate. The Brutox seeking fresh meat then turned to face the harpies.

Both Khazbar and Wazzock  cast heal but this time they split the spells between the Spirit Walkers and the Guardian Brutes.

11 Turn 5 - Mark Herd

Turn 5 – Tony’s Herd

With a steely determination (or like a dog refusing to let go of a bone), the Harpies again charged the Zurrock and finally bought down the resilient Chieftain.

12 Turn 5 - Tony Herd

Turn 6 – Herd of Khazbar

We didn’t actually play this turn but it was pretty obvious that the raging Brutox would catch the harpies, whilst Tony’s Shaman’s would scuttle away to safety, keeping out of charge arcs and with that we called the game.


The final result was:

Mark – Killed: 1,760pts

Tony – Killed: 465pts

A first win for the Herd of Khazbar the Reborn and a whole 2 points!!


It was a thoroughly enjoyable game as it was very social and I got to know Tony a bit more. His army was mainly composed of classic GW metal Beastmen miniatures and those that were painted looked fantastic.

It turned out that Tony had played around the same number of KOW games as I had (not many) but over a much greater period, with his first game being just after KOW 2nd Ed had been released. Like me, he had entered the comp to get some games and further experience under his belt.

As with my last fight I had sketched out a pre-battle deployment. It had some fluidity as I wanted to ensure the Guardian Brutes were not impeded by terrain and I wanted to use the Brutox and Chieftain to get Tony to deploy items on the opposite flank to give the Stampede a chance to clear up the opposite one. In the main I was happy with how deployment worked out. His deployment was not too far off what I expected. I did underestimate what a wide frontage his force would have.

Leaving the flank of the stampede exposed to the hunters was an error. I underestimated that they could do that much damage even from the flank and the waver, although unexpected, could have as easily it could have been a route. I have a real blind spot with this unit and keep making the same mistake each game. It also shows that if I split my forces I really need a source of healing for each element (in this case, preferably a mounted shammy to keep up and also inspire!).

In hindsight (which is always a marvelous thing) I think Tony made a couple of errors in the game. Taking the bait and charging the beast pack with his Warriors took them out of the battle line and allowed me to duel charge them and destroy the unit in one round of combat. This lost him his superior numbers in the centre. Admittedly he was unlucky not to take my Spirit Walkers out in his turn and my double heal on the unit was definitely above average and kept them in the fight. In fact most of my heal rolls were very high which helped my hordes outlast Tony’s.

Holding back with the chariots and shooting the other beast pack may also have been the better option too as it would have allowed his longhorns to move up in support. In fairness he did forget they had bows at the time.

I also think he may have been better off moving the other longhorn unit so it was slightly in the woods. This would have given him the ability to flank the Brutox in combat with his Brutox. Even ending the Harpies first move in the woods, rather than behind them, would have influenced how I played both that flank and the centre. As it was I was able to use the woods to shield my movements.

Overall, although the margin of victory was quite high, I would say that this was more down to Tony’s lack of recent practice, rather than any superior generalship on my behalf. Good dice rolls and not making any real serious blunders also helped swing the battle my way.

My final group game vs Alex’s elves is scheduled in for 19th May.

KOW – Herd vs Dan’s Dwarves – SELWG Competition game

In the second of my competition battles (and second game in two days), I played against my old adversary Dan. I was really curious what he would bring, as not only have I faced Dan in battle many times at Warhammer (though not at KOW) but he was also using one of my favourite armies, dwarves and i wanted to see how different his list would be from what I would create (the answer is: quite a bit).

Dan’s Dwarf list – 2000pts

Mounted Berserker Lord – 140pts

Army Standard Bearer – 50pts

Stone Priest – 120pts

Stone Priest – 120pts

Shieldbreaker Horde – 215pts

Shieldbreaker Horde – 215pts

Rangers Regiment – 180pts

Berserker Brock Riders Regiment – Potion of the Caterpillar – 230pts

Berserker Brock Riders Regiment – Gem of Zellak – 240pts

Flame Belcher – 85pts

Flame Belcher – 85pts

Greater Earth Elemental – 160pts

Greater Earth Elemental – 160pts

The entire army has the headstrong rule so can ignore wavers on a 4+. I don’t think this is one of the more useful army traits but it is what it is.

He has several elements that I would say obviously work together.

Core – The 2 Shieldbreaker hordes have average hit and defence stats and again average horde attacks with the normal high nerve. They do have CS2 so will damage more easily.  I would expect these to form the centre of the army.

Standard bearer – I suspect this will closely follow the 2 hordes as their source of inspiring.

Support. 2 Flame Belchers. 2 sources of 18 attacks with a 16″ effective range that always hits on a 4+ (as we are not using CoK rules) is enough to give me the shivers after my experience with Efreets. I suspect they will also be backing up the 2 hordes and used to soften up anything that came close to them.

2 Greater Earth Elementals each supported by a stone priest in order to surge them. They can also inspire the elements and cast bane chant on anything within 12″ of them (though they can’t BC + surge in the same turn). The Earth elementals only have 8 attacks and an average hit roll, however with CS 3 they will damage any of my army on a 2+ and surge gives them a good chance of hitting the flank. They have a high 6+ defence and a solid nerve meaning it will be difficult to shift them. In some ways the high CS attacks of the elementals and shield breakers are wasted on my list as I tend to have low defence so it doesn’t make a huge difference.

Fast attack. Rangers – 24″ ranged attacks, combined with vanguard means they will be attacking early on. They only have average hit and def stats and reasonably low attacks. I would expect them to advance in order to project an early threat to stall my advance and to try and clear out my chaff.

2 units of berserker brock riders. This is the true fast element of the army. They have high attacks and nerve and are fearless. They have TC1 and vicious so will hit reasonably hard on the charge. This is offset by their average to hit and defence stats. One unit has pathfinder to help ensure they don’t lose TC1. The other has the scrying Gem that makes his opponent have to lay D3+1 units before he does. With his higher unit count, this means he will know where the majority of my army is deployed so I need to have a plan straight off the bat.

The final part of his army is a mounted berserker lord. 8 attacks with CS1, vicious and hitting on 3+ means he will kick out a solid number of wounds. He does have nimble meaning he can easily get into flanks, round units but has individual so won’t double/triple attacks. He also inspires brock riders so will likely roll with them.

As expected with Dan, he has built his army thinking about synergies. I can see how I would run his list with the horde core backed up with warmachines. His brocks could be run as a pack or on each flank and his elementals run the same way. Saying that, i’m not sure if he would run it the same way though!

His army is slow and so he has tried to offset this with the Gem, forcing me to lay between 2 and 5 drops before him (depending on who won the roll and his D3 roll). As he starts with 13 drops vs my 11, he would always have a slight advantage and using the Gem will also mean that he will likely be reacting to my deployment. This could actually go against him as not only should I be able to anticipate how he will deploy based on how I lay my units, but due to the slow speed of dwarves I feel you should not be reactionary in deployment but lay according to the objectives rolled (though perhaps this holds true to some extent for all armies).

The key for me will be to overwhelm sections of his army quickly. His biggest attack range is an 16″ charge from the brocks and 16″ fire range from the flame belchers. Yes the Earth Elementals have a maximum charge of 10″ plus a potential 8″ surge but this is unlikely to occur. This means I have the edge in movement speed and so need to utilise this to multicharge. If he splits the brocks, then one unit of beasts will block them to set up a counter, leaving the other (or a Brutox) to target a flame belcher.

I can see me utilising a refused flank a lot with the herd, the centre anchored with my horde, Brutox on both flanks.

To recap my list.

The Herd of Khazbar Reborn – 2000pts

Khazbar – Shaman – heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed – Shaman – heal – 120pts

Zurrock the Mighty – Chieftain on Chariot – bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers – Horde – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Stampede – Horde – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes – Horde – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Brutox – 220pts

Brutox – 220pts


We used Neil’s terrain chart and rolled Map 5, which contained: 4*buildings, 1*tree base, 2*WHF, 1 hill.

Hills are height 2, Trees and buildings height 4.

I won the roll and so was designated player A.

Terrain deployment instructions Map 5.

  1. Player A places 2*buildings & 1*WHF anywhere on the table, but not In any DZ, at least 6” from any table edge, & both buildings no further apart than 6” with WHF linking both buildings in nay configuration.
  2. Player B places 2*buildings & 1*WHF anywhere but In any DZ at least 6” from any table edge, & both buildings no further apart than 6” with WHF linking both buildings in any configuration. Also must be at least 12” away from nearest building in A above.
  3. Player A places 1*tress anywhere on the table at least 9” from any table edge.
  4. Player B places 1*hill anywhere on the table at least 9” from any table edge.


I was hoping that I didn’t get loot again and when we rolled Pillage, I was more than happy as it was another first for me.

We rolled 7 objectives and Dan placed the first token. When finished the Terrain and objectives looked like this.

1 terrain


We then rolled for sides, which I won and again in my normal display of tactical acruity picked the side I was already on. As such I had the first drop and Dan deployed his gem of something or other which forced me to lay an additional unit off the bat.

I again followed my rough deployment plan that I had sketched out and had used the night before, not worrying about Dan’s deployment strategy too much. He did pretty much do what I was expecting using a symmetrical deployment but with the Brock riders all on one flank.

Dan then won the roll for turn choice and decided to go first.

As normal I’ll caveat that any mistakes are down to memory or lack of photos/notes.

2 Deployment

2 - Deployment3 - Deployment4 - Deployment

Turn 1 – Dwarves

The dwarves started aggressively, the infantry moving up as far as they could and the Stone Priests each surging an Elemental.

The Rangers, who had vanguarded, shot the slavering Brutox in front of them but caused minimal damage.

3 turn 1 dwarves

7 - Turn 1 Dwarf
Note the black square is the 7th objective, I only had 6 markers!
8 - Turn 1 Dwarf

Turn 1 – Herd

The herd responded cautiously, edging forward, ensuring they remained out of charge ranges on all fronts

The Chieftain opened fire on the nearest Brock Riders causing as much damage as the rangers had the previous turn (almost bugger all).

4 turn 1 herd

9 - Turn 1 Herd10 - Turn 1 Herd11 - Turn 1 Herd

Turn 2 – Dwarves

The dwarf advance stalled on all fronts with most of the infantry following the lead of the herd and also creeping forward. The exception was the Brock Riders who continued to move up to threaten the herd left flank.

The rangers again shot the Brutox who roared in frustration at the puny midgets in front of him.

5 turn 2 dwarves

12 - Turn 2 Dwarf13 - Turn 2 Dwarf14 - Turn 2 Dwarf

Turn 2 – Herd

The Chieftain again shot at the same Brock Riders but failed to do anything of note. The Beast pack on that flank moved up to do what it is good at and blocked the two units of Brocks and their lord.

On the far flank the Brutox piled into the rangers, healing as it did so, horns and blades tearing bodies apart and wavering the unit with the force of the charge.

The central units also chose this moment to strike, with the Stampede smashing the nearest Elemental into dust. The Guardian Brutes on the other side of the wood, hit the other stone monster so hard that cracks appeared all over it but unlike its twin, it managed to retain its form.

The final beast pack moved up to block the path of one of the Shieldbreaker hordes so they couldn’t counter the Stampede.

6 turn 2 herd

15 - Turn 2 Herd16 - Turn 2 Herd17 - Turn 2 Herd18 - Turn 2 Herd

Turn 3 – Dwarves

In a wave of charges the dwarf forces engaged the herd. One unit of Brock riders and their lord tore apart the interfering dogs and eagerly eyed up their next target. The other unit of brocks noticed the flank of the stampede was just within their sight and made them pay for that opening. The Flame Belcher near them supported the attack by trying to burn away the Brutox with limited success.

Unable to get to the Spirit Walkers, the horde of Shieldbreakers charged the blocking unit of dogs. The remaining Elemental eager to get away from the Brutes, turned and also charged their flank. Suffice to say the dogs were ground to paste in short order! The remaining unit of Shieldbreakers, their path clear, hit the Brutes but bounced off after a lackluster round of hindered attacks.

On the other flank, the second flame belcher softened up the Longhorns and the Rangers, shaking off the effects of the previous combat, counter-charged the Brutox and continued to chip away at it.

7 turn 3 dwarves

19 - Turn 3 Dwarf20 - Turn 3 Dwarf

Turn 3 – Herd

With the left flank hanging in the balance, the Chieftain and Brutox, in a gamble, both charged the damaged regiment of Brock Riders, knowing the result of the ensuing melee would decide that flank. They failed to remove the unit and were now in a bad position and prepared to sacrifice themselves for the cause.

The Tribal Spirit Walkers finally able to contribute and buffed with a bane chant, smashed into the flank of the elemental which was removed in short order (edit: with 70 attacks incoming we just double 1’ed it). The Guardian Brutes and Longhorns both charged the horde of dwarves in front of them but despite inflicting massive damage the horde remained.

On the far flank, the Brutox continued to regenerate damage and finished off the rangers, over-running to clear the building.

8 turn 3 herd

22 - Turn 3 Herd23 - Turn 3 Herd24 - Turn 3 Herd

Turn 4 – Dwarves

A charge to the flank of the Brutox, from Brock Riders, resulted in one large corpse but the Chieftain was a tougher proposition and survived the effort of the other Brock unit to remove it. The left Shieldbreaker horde held back in order to allow the Flame Belcher to soften the Spirit Walker horde before the next combat started. The other Belcher continued to target the Longhorn Regiment.

In the centre, the second horde of Shieldbreakers counter-charged the Brutes and despite being  hindered routed the unit.

9 turn 4 dwarves

25 - Turn 4 Dwarf26 - Turn 4 Dwarf27 - Turn 4 Dwarf

Turn 4 – Herd

The Chieftain again charged the damaged Brocks but displaying the stubbornness that defines their race, the buggers just refused to die.

The remaining Brutox moved up ready to contest the objective nearby.

The fight in the woods continued with the Spirit Walkers inflicting massive damage on the Shieldbreakers but due to the nearby ASB they held their ground. On the other side of the woods, the other unit of Shieldbreakers had left their flank unguarded and the Longhorns, now almost fully healed thanks to Khazbar, took full advantage, shattering their formation.

10 turn 4 herd

Turn 5 – Dwarves

The two units of Brocks crushed the Chieftain and his chariot between them and turned to face some of the unclaimed objectives (edit: we again just double 1’ed this).

The Shieldbreakers charged the Spirit horde and achieved what the herd unit had failed to accomplish and destroyed them in the combat. This result was helped by the Flame Belcher first taking out the nearby Shaman.

11 turn 5 dwarves

Turn 5 – Herd

With very little remaining to the herd at this point, it’s options were limited. The Longhorns moved up to contest the central objective, Khazbar again healing the unit. The Brutox charged the Flame Belcher and although inflicting a massive 17 wounds, failed to shift it! (edit: we just rolled the break test, but due to an actual double 1 result, for fun, we then rolled to see what the damage would have been ).

12 turn 5 herd

28 - Turn 5 Herd29 - Turn 5 Herd

Turn 6 – Dwarves

The Dwarves realised that the game was still in the balance and the brock riders moved off to secure objectives.

The Shieldbreakers made a hindered charge against the Longhorns but failed to shift them. Likewise the flame belcher could only wound Khazbar.

13 turn 6 dwarves

Turn 6 – Herd

The Brutox again charged the nearest flame belcher and this time the dice were more favourable and removed it from the table, claiming the nearby objective.

The Longhorns, glee in their eyes, wiped the last of the shieldbreakers from the woods, the blood of their corpses would help feed the trees and keep them healthy for some time. This had the added bonus of allowing them to claim the central objective.

14 turn 6 herd

Turn 7 – Dwarves

In a hopeful move the Brock lord charged the Brutox but his feeble attacks failed to shift it from the objective.

The remaining flame beltcher fired everything at the longhorns in the woods, its cleansing fire burning away large swathes of the wood and the beastmen with it! (Edit: this was about the first time Dan rolled more than 4 wounds with a flame belcher all game!)

15 turn 7 dwarves

Turn 7 – Herd

In the final acts of the game, the Brutox healed most of the damage on it but this effort distracted it and it failed to do more than a scratch to the Brock Lord.

16 turn 7 herd


A win for Dan with 2 objectives to my 1. (Edit: I’m sure his flame belcher was not in range of the middle counter but either way he had won).

In terms of remaining points for the tie-breaker claculation, Dan had 985 pts and I had 350pts remaining.


So close to a draw! Damn the fickle turn 7 dice gods.

Again it struck me how fast the game is. Dan’s train was delayed and he only got to the club around 8, but we still finished the game by 10.30. True neither of us spent ages over our turns but playing 8th we would have likely started at 7 and be just about wrapping up for 11 (depending on how close the game was of course).

Dan and I were also chatting about chess clocks during the match (comp or not it’s always a very social game between us) and we are both intrigued about them. I can see us giving it a go in a future game.

So what went well?

Again I was reasonably happy with my deployment strategy. There was a good chance he was always going to be able to react to my drops so having the plan in advance (and just about correctly guessing his) really removed the bad decisions I often make if I do the reacting. Again it wasn’t perfect but it’s allowing me to make small tweaks to the drops and learning to work these into ‘the plan’

Managing to fight most of the central battle in the woods really worked in my favour as his big blocks were hindered in their initial charges. I know Dan shook his head over that and won’t make the same mistake again.

‘The bad’

For the second game in a row I really felt the lack of pathfinder on the guardian brutes. In this game this came down to where I deployed them. Putting them opposite the wood was just stupid, at the very least I should have swopped them with the longhorns.

My positioning of the Stampede after combat (for the second game in a row), was awful and allowed it to be flank charged and removed in one round of combat. Part of this was down to forgetting about the difference between whfb wheeling and pivoting as the beast pack would have blocked the wheel. The other part is looking around after combat and deciding what I need to do. In this case even moving slightly forward would have meant they couldn’t be charged.

On turn 3 before I dual charged the brocks with the Chieftain/Brutox, I instead nearly nipped the chief through a gap into Dans back field, figuring he could then hunt down characters/warmachines. What held me back was, if I had done this, then the Brutox would have definitely died that turn and the Brocks would have had free reign. By charging the Brutox and Chieftain there was a chance that I could have killed the brocks which would have allowed the same scenario and if I didn’t then the brocks would have to kill both of them to get back in the game. I’m still not sure if it was the right decision, it probably was but the doubt remains especially as I could have gone after his ASB and or the flame belcher. Got to love second guessing yourself!
Overall, another very fun game. There were far less rule queries in this one and that was likely due clearing them up in the previous nights game.

Thoughts on my list so far.

Just in general, I’ve been pretty happy with the items selected. CS1 on the spirit walkers has been really helpful in most games and made a big difference. Elite on the brutes has worked really well, though as per a suggestion on the Herd FB group, I would be tempted to put that on the stampede as not only do they have more attacks but it’s also the cheaper of the items and I keep screwing up and allowing the Stampede to die to flanks…

KOW – Herd vs Gregs Twilight Kin

After previously having to cancel my game with Greg, we managed to re-organise the game for a Thursday night, though this time we would both be using our competition lists but in a friendly game. It was good to get another practice game in after my previous drubbing by Neil as it showed I definitely needed to get to know my army better. It was also the first time I’d played both Greg and this army, which is always an added bonus. Greg is one of my fellow D&D adventurers but we’ve never managed to have a battle before. You can follow his adventures and see a different perspective of this battle on his blog: It’s a Small World

I’m not sure if booking in this game, the day before my second competition game, will help or hinder…

I will apologise in advance for the pictures, as some are quite dark. I also forgot to take them on a number of turns.

Greg’s Twilight Kin – 2000pts

Horde of Crossbowmen – 250pts

Regiment of Blade Dancers (brew of courage) – 215pts

Troop of Scouts – 130pts

Regiment of Dark Knights (Potion of the Caterpillar) – 230pts

Troop of Heralds of Woe – 145pts

Horde of Abyssal Riders – 260pts

Bolt Thrower – 90pts

Bolt Throwers – 90pts

Hydra – 140pts

Lord on Dragon (ensorcelled armour) – 345pts

Sorceress (inspiring talisman + banechant) – 105pts

Evaluation of List

I know for a fact that Greg’s list was mainly shaped by the models he has available but that doesn’t stop there being a number of things that concern me with it. It’s the first time I’ve faced any shooting and the big horde of crossbows with their high nerve and 24″ range will potentially create a no go area. I will need to disrupt them asap.

Likewise the 2 bolt throwers with their huge range of 48″ will be hitting my forces almost immediately and likely targeting the Brutox or Chieftain (that is why one of the reasons I have 2 large monsters, to hopefully cause indecision). Lacking flyers, I may struggle to reach them easily.

His Knights and Abyssal riders are very hard hitting and so I will probably use my normal tactic of blocking them with my dogs and lining up counter charges behind them.

The Hydra isn’t too dangerous until it takes damage when it’s attacks multiply. I think the trick will be to ignore it (as if!) or try and take it out in one turn.

The lord on dragon I can foresee being a nightmare. Def 6 makes it difficult to wound and with fly, it means it can get behind my lines and cause considerable disruption. I’ll need to ensure a second line to try and prevent this occurring.

The Shadows and Heralds of woe are his version of chaff, but are a little expensive for that role. They do have the ability to get into range very quickly and start targeting my own chaff to take it out early.

Lastly his regiment of Blade Dancers (witch elves) I can also see causing me some trouble. They have a lot of attacks and have rules designed to let them keep attacking unless they are routed.

Overall a lot of hard hitting units backed up with some good ranged attacks. The one thing I must remember is to very much concentrate on the objectives and not killing his army (unless that is the objective of course!). Not doing so nearly cost me the first game.

The Herd of Khazbar Reborn – 2000pts.

Khazbar – Shaman – heal + Myrddin’s Amulet – 130pts

Wazzock the Renewed – Shaman – heal – 120pts

Zurrock the Mighty – Chieftain on Chariot – bows + Fire Oil – 205pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Beast Pack – Troop – 70pts

Tribal Spirit Walkers – Horde – Brew of Strength – 260pts

Longhorns – Regiment – 145pts

Stampede – Horde – Brew of Sharpness – 305pts

Guardian Brutes – Horde – Blessing of the Gods – 255pts

Brutox – 220pts

Brutox – 220pts

Terrain and Scenario

We did roll on Neil’s terrain table but it was one with a river and as we were playing at Greg’s house with limited terrain, we just asked one of his sons to place the pieces on the table and then rolled for sides, which I won.

We had a house (H4), Hill (H2), Marsh (H0 – difficult terrain), Ruins (H1 – difficult terrain) and  a row of walls (H1).

The scenario was Kill, which was quite nice, as it was Greg’s first game, so kept things simple.


As I won the roll for sides, I got the honor of laying the first unit. Rather than reacting to Greg’s drops, I pretty much kept with the pre-match deployment I had devised (refused flank). As we were using a kitchen table that was roughly 6-3 rather than the standard 6-4 board, it did mean that you didn’t have the space to complete double rank deployments.

After deployment it looked like this. I then won first turn which I elected to take.

2. Deployment

1 deploy3 deploy4 deploy - kin5 deploy - kin7 deploy kin

Turn 1 – Herd

On the left flank the beast pack began ‘operation human shield’ and rushed up to block both the Shadowdancers and Abyssal Riders, which allowed the Stampede, Chieftain and one of the Brutox to move up into their charge distance with no fear of retaliation in the following turn.

In the centre, the horde of Spirit Walkers moved at the double to ensure they were able to use the wall to hinder any attacks against them. The Brutox and Longhorns maneuvered to try and block any attempt by the dragon to land behind the herd lines. The right beast pack decided to mince around not quite sure of what they were doing but vaguely trying to stop the heralds of woe from also getting behind the lines.

The Guardian Brutes meanwhile marched up to threaten the Twilight Kin shooters, realising they had the best chance to survive the inevitable hail of bolts coming their way. It helped that Khazbar had decided to skulk behind them to offer his support.

Turn 1 - Herd

8 herd turn 19 herd turn 110 herd turn 1

Turn 1 – Twilight Kin


As expected, the crossbow horde opened fire on the horde of wild eyed, stamping, horned monstrosities that was, both in front and threatening them. The nearby priestess, also looking a tad worried, launched a fireball into them but both attacks failed to inflict significant damage.

The Dark Lord then joined in the fun and threw a lightning bolt into the Brutox opposite him causing minor damage. The Shadows and Heralds of Woe looked at one another and decided that some battersea dogs just wouldn’t ever find a good home so decided to euthanase them. (Cue tumbleweed for overseas readers who likely won’t get that reference…)

On the far flank, the Bolt thrower crew were looking even more worried than their crossbow brethren, as the hulking giant they had just fired at, ripped the bolt out and started looking their way

Turn 1 - Greg

Turn 2 – Herd

The Brutox started the charge, smashing to pieces the bolt thrower that had just shot him. The crew member he then ate appeared to agree with him, as some of the damage previously inflicted healed over.

The other Brutox, deciding to outdo his sibling, then fully healed himself.

The Minotaurs unable to contain themselves, stormed into the crossbow horde causing significant damage. This was helped by the bane chant Khazbar threw on them and then a heal in order to help them survive the inevitable counter.

Turn 2 - Herd

12 herd turn 2

Turn 2 – Twilight Kin

Realising that they were in danger of being flanked, the Abyssal Riders pivoted so any charge would hit their front arc. The Shadowdancers next to them, lost control and butchered the beasts in front of them.

The crossbow horde, with very little option, counter charged the Brutes and the single wound caused was enough to waver them. The bolt thrower and priestess decided to target Khazbar with bolts and flames respectively and although pierced and singed he remained standing.

On the herd right flank, the Heralds and  shadows again combined their fire, this time against the Brutox who bellowed in pain as he accumulated arrows in his hide. The Hydra and Dark Knights used the distraction of the noise to charge the Spirit Walkers but the charge was hindered and the horde held.

Turn 2 - Greg

11 herd turn 213 - Kin turn 214 kin turn 215 kin turn 2

Turn 3 – Herd

With a bellow of rage, the Brutox crashed into the flank of the Dark Knights whilst the spirit horde, seeking revenge hit their front. Despite bodies and mounts flying through the air from the impact, the Knights weathered the brutal charge.

The other Brutox and Chieftain combined to charge the Abyssal Riders and again, despite significant damage, the horde held and prepared to unleash hell.

The Stampede, doing what it does best, obliterated the Shadowdancers and started to eye up the juicy flank of the Abyssal riders.

In the centre, realising that there was a giant dragon looking intently at him, Khazbar decided it would be prudent to move out of the way and scuttled round the side of the building. The fear of the attack disturbed his concentration enough that he failed to cast any spells. The Guardian Brutes ignoring their waver crashed back into the Crossbow horde and when they had finished had left nothing but bits of limbs and blood soaking into the ground. Looking around for their next target, they spotted the nearby Bolt thrower and Priestess.

Turn 3 - Herd

17 herd turn 318 herd turn 319 herd turn 320 herd turn 3

Turn 3 – Twilight Kin

The Abyssal riders, wounds regenerating, charged into the already damaged Brutox, who shrugged off their blows.

The Shadows and Heralds again fired everything at the nearest Brutox and the weight of fire was enough to bring the great beast down. The Hydra and Knights likewise combined again to hit the Spirit Walker horde and this time wiped the frothing lunatics out.

The Priestess, looking at the horde of red eyed, snorting Minotaurs, decided discretion was the better part of valor and ran round the side of them launching fireballs into their flank. The nearby Dark Lord and Dragon, noticed that the movement of the Guardian Brutes had left open a path into Khazbar and duly ran him down. The momentum of the charge then carried the monster and rider into the flank of the Stampede and it also tore them apart.

Things were not looking so good for the herd across the battlefield…

Turn 3 - Greg

Turn 4 – Twilight Kin

In the final turn of the game (it was late and a week night), The Twilight Kin tried to maximise the destruction of the herd army. The Hydra charged the only unit in range but failed to do anything to the elite Longhorns.

The Heralds and Shadows both shot at Wazzock, who shrugged off the wounds.

In the final roll of the dice, the Dark Lord and Dragon hit the already damaged remaining Brutox, removing it from the board.

Turn 4 - Greg


After totaling up the remaining points, it was 865 vs 725 in favour of the Twilight Kin. Because it was within 200 points it was a draw. Hat off to Greg for the moral victory, especially in his first game.


The first thing which jumped out is although the rules are far more streamlined than whfb, I still am still lacking in knowledge and we had to look up rules a number of times and I also got some of the rules incorrect (in fairness it was only my 3rd game).

An example is not remembering how regenerate works. The first 2 turns I had it in my head that you just rolled two dice rather than dice equal to the wounds taken (I also forgot to roll on another turn but that was my own fault).  It could have been the difference between the right flank Brutox living past the Twilight Kin turn 3, rather than dying to the accumulated bow fire.

Not managing to cast a single Bane-Chant after the first turn shows that you can’t rely on magic in this game either!

I did have fun and was pleased I finally managed to play against Greg.

My biggest mistake (bar normal deployment) was probably the pivot of the Stampede after killing the Shadowdancers, I not only left it’s flank exposed to a potential charge from the dragon, when the Brutox and Chieftain already had that flank covered but if he had charged the Abyssals, it would have moved them away from the rest of the battle for the remaining turns.

The left flank beast pack did its job by blocking both the dancers and Abyssals but the problem with the double block was they had to get close enough to do so, that it was stuck in place and when Greg chose not to charge them my Stampede did nothing for a turn.

I had been expecting my Shamen to die quickly which is why he used the amulet the first turn. It was just slightly unlucky that the pivot of the brutes left him exposed to the charge.

What went well?

I was pretty happy with the deployment, in so far as I knew where I wanted things to go and they worked reasonably well. I found this worked more than the indecision and reacting to his deployment. Yes there were some questionable placements but the issues around these were more to do with what I did with them afterwards.

I did the right thing in ignoring the hydra. Without the additional attacks it receives when damaged, it is pretty meh (although it’s a fantastic model he uses for it).

Using the guardian brutes against the crossbows was definitely a good choice. The crossbows really struggled to damage them and once in combat, it was only ever going to go one way. With the large route value, I needed a lot of attacks to remove them quickly, however the question is whether another unit would have been a better option. The Stampede has enough attacks and hits hard enough that it might have taken out the unit in one turn and then would be in a central position to then decide where to go. Their pathfinder rule would also have helped from that position. But it would have been a waste of their high TC. A Brutox would also have worked in the role but in a different way as it would have held them up for the game but may have struggled to remove the horde.

Parking the spirit walkers behind the wall massively helped them survive due the hindered charge scenario. I’m not sure if we played the counter charge correctly though. The walkers definitely need a chaff cover. They need to get the charge it as they take damage too easily. Already I have a good idea of what my v.2 list will contain.
With regards to Gregs list, I found the Bolt throwers to be actually quite under whelming. I know they are cheap and you can’t judge based on one game but for less than the cost of both of them, you could get another unit of scouts or heralds and I’d probably go that route as they were able to reliably plink wounds off all game. It has made me think about revising my elf list to remove them. It is worth noting that because we were playing on a 3ft wide table they were within charge range within 2 turns, whereas a deeper table would likely have given them an additional turn. I’m still not convinced by them though.

Having read A lot of Swordmasters battle reps, I’d advise greg to concentrate fire on units rather than fire piecemeal.